Cycling in Waterloo Region

[tomh009]

That stretch of Benton is a regional road so it won't be on the city's plans.

It's four lanes because of long-abandoned plans to make Frederick/Benton a major thoroughfare connecting Victoria St N at one end to Queen St S on the other.

[panamaniac]

I don’t think there’s a plan yet for a re-worked Benton, is there? I’d like to see a terraced boulevard down the centre of the hill with plantings and flowing water ....

[dtkvictim]

The "Downtown Cycling Grid Project Information.pdf" on the Engage page shows Benton from Courtland to Charles as well as Frederick from Duke to Lancaster as "Planned: Street Reconstruction (Region)". This is on the slide with the proposed network map. Given that it's highlighted on this network map it seems likely cycling infrastructure will be involved?

I tried to google for it, I found some 4+ year old Region documents that mention that stretch of Benton, but also listed 2018 as the construction date. I'm not really familiar with where to find this information.

[danbrotherston]

I don't have time to look through the construction drawings, but the renders and maps on the information sheet look like a huge step in the right direction (even if imperfect).

Does anyone know what the planned road reconstruction is on Benton from Courtland to Charles? I don't understand why it's 4 lanes, and it could potentially be a great connection to the Mike Wagner green and IHT if they put in cycling infrastructure there. Although it will probably always lack connecting infrastructure from Charles/Frederick because of the LRT.

The region is planning work, but has not started designing yet. I fear if left to their own devices, it will be mediocre...even if they do narrow it.

I am in the middle of my own project on this topic, and I will post soon

[tomh009]

I don’t think there’s a plan yet for a re-worked Benton, is there?  I’d like to see a terraced boulevard down the centre of the hill with plantings and flowing water and a portico ....

I fixed that for you!

[panamaniac]

I don’t think there’s a plan yet for a re-worked Benton, is there?  I’d like to see a terraced boulevard down the centre of the hill with plantings and flowing water and a portico ....

I fixed that for you!

You can’t have too many porticos, but I’m thinking gazebos, in this case ...
Although a triumphal arch might be nice too, if we can agree on a triumph to commemorate.

[danbrotherston]

I don’t think there’s a plan yet for a re-worked Benton, is there?  I’d like to see a terraced boulevard down the centre of the hill with plantings and flowing water ....

No plan yet, the city would like there to be bicycle infra, knowing the region, bike infra is probably on the table, I can see them proposing a mediocre 3 lane road with painted bike lanes.

I also don't like the idea of a center boulevard, they end up just being dead space, and worse, they necessitate a wider lanes because the region insists on minimum 4.5 meter wide curb to curb distance, and obviously it's just a wide road to begin with.

I have a different proposal.

https://youtu.be/rygMdouzi_I

[tomh009]

I fixed that for you!

You can’t have too many porticos, but I’m thinking gazebos, in this case ...
Although a triumphal arch might be nice too, if we can agree on a triumph to commemorate.

Well, once we beat this COVID thing, we could build an arch and have the front-line workers parade through?

[tomh009]

I don’t think there’s a plan yet for a re-worked Benton, is there?  I’d like to see a terraced boulevard down the centre of the hill with plantings and flowing water ....

No plan yet, the city would like there to be bicycle infra, knowing the region, bike infra is probably on the table, I can see them proposing a mediocre 3 lane road with painted bike lanes.

I also don't like the idea of a center boulevard, they end up just being dead space, and worse, they necessitate a wider lanes because the region insists on minimum 4.5 meter wide curb to curb distance, and obviously it's just a wide road to begin with.

I have a different proposal.

https://youtu.be/rygMdouzi_I

How did you envision the bus stop working? Pax would cross either the road or the cycle path to get to the stop? Does the bus actually stop in the parking lane, or only the pax would be there, with the bus in the traffic lane?

Also, what's the cause/reason for the squiggle in the cycle path between Arrow Lofts and Arrow 2?

[panamaniac]

You can’t have too many porticos, but I’m thinking gazebos, in this case ...
Although a triumphal arch might be nice too, if we can agree on a triumph to commemorate.

Well, once we beat this COVID thing, we could build an arch and have the front-line workers parade through?

Call it the coronarch ...

[danbrotherston]

No plan yet, the city would like there to be bicycle infra, knowing the region, bike infra is probably on the table, I can see them proposing a mediocre 3 lane road with painted bike lanes.

I also don't like the idea of a center boulevard, they end up just being dead space, and worse, they necessitate a wider lanes because the region insists on minimum 4.5 meter wide curb to curb distance, and obviously it's just a wide road to begin with.

I have a different proposal.

https://youtu.be/rygMdouzi_I

How did you envision the bus stop working? Pax would cross either the road or the cycle path to get to the stop? Does the bus actually stop in the parking lane, or only the pax would be there, with the bus in the traffic lane?

Also, what's the cause/reason for the squiggle in the cycle path between Arrow Lofts and Arrow 2?

The squiggle is just because the building isn't done right now and the road is partially closed on the sat view, so I more or less guessed where it should be, but it's a bit off there.

As for bus stops, I'm envisioning standard dutch (and others) design, bike lane goes behind the bus stop and shelter, peds cross to the bike lane and wait on the concrete pad (I think there's room for a shelter, although there is not one there now). The buses stop in the traffic lane. GRT prefers this for operations anyway, and traffic is extremely minimal anyway. I think this design can be accomodated throughout, ultimately the road is four lanes wide, and only needs two to handle the extremely low traffic volumes.

   

Further up near King there is another bus stop, but I am envisioning buses stopping on the other side of the LRT station, as they do on Willis Way. I think it can be accomplished without much construction, the bus only needs a short distance to stop, either end would work.

[tomh009]

Thanks for the clarification.

I believe there is a bus stop on Benton in front of the parking garage (near the Charles LRT stop), and another one on Frederick in front Crabby Joe's (next to the Market Square LRT stop). Plus the one on Benton at the top of the hill, and one on Charles across from the LRT stop, for westbound buses.

It's a few blocks of pretty high density of bus stops!

[danbrotherston]

Thanks for the clarification.

I believe there is a bus stop on Benton in front of the parking garage (near the Charles LRT stop), and another one on Frederick in front Crabby Joe's (next to the Market Square LRT stop). Plus the one on Benton at the top of the hill, and one on Charles across from the LRT stop, for westbound buses.

It's a few blocks of pretty high density of bus stops!

You are right, and some may need to move.

This isn’t supposed to be a real engineering plan, more of an argument away from the mediocre designs I kind of expect. Plus it solves the self inflicted failure between Charles And Duke.

[tomh009]

Yeah, as a starting point for a discussion about what we should do, I think it's a great start.

[westwardloo]

No plan yet, the city would like there to be bicycle infra, knowing the region, bike infra is probably on the table, I can see them proposing a mediocre 3 lane road with painted bike lanes.

I also don't like the idea of a center boulevard, they end up just being dead space, and worse, they necessitate a wider lanes because the region insists on minimum 4.5 meter wide curb to curb distance, and obviously it's just a wide road to begin with.

I have a different proposal.

https://youtu.be/rygMdouzi_I

Thanks for sharing! Hopefully the region takes these comments into their proposal for the reworking of Benton/ Frederick. I would love to see your sketches for phase 2/3. I live near Frederick mall and would love to have a separated bike path directly into downtown.