Gaukel Street Pedestrian Promenade

[kwcc]

I don't think your reading of the traffic study is very accurate. 
It's not true that "traffic is simply being shifted from Joseph to Charles". If so, that still begs the question, what about the impacts of dividing the pedestrian street by a busy street, Charles? 
The City's traffic study showed a significant increase of cars diverting to local streets.
Those streets have a significant number of people living in affordable housing. Do you support the displacement of those families and the kids who can currently ride their bikes on the street?

The victoria park neighbourhood is not known for affordable housing...at best, it's a mixed neighbourhood with a little of everything, it's a great place, and the traffic shifted there is largely as a result of closing Water St at Jubilee.

I think it's wonderful that we're not "known for affordable housing". We're happy and support being a "mixed neighbourhood" and, I'd agree, that's part of what makes it a great place. Please, don't displace the kids and families that make it so.

[danbrotherston]

The victoria park neighbourhood is not known for affordable housing...at best, it's a mixed neighbourhood with a little of everything, it's a great place, and the traffic shifted there is largely as a result of closing Water St at Jubilee.

I think it's wonderful that we're not "known for affordable housing". We're happy and support being a "mixed neighbourhood" and, I'd agree, that's part of what makes it a great place. Please, don't displace the kids and families that make it so.

I have no idea what you're talking about? Who do you feel is being displaced by the Downtown Grid OR the Gaukel St. plaza?

[kwcc]

I think it's wonderful that we're not "known for affordable housing". We're happy and support being a "mixed neighbourhood" and, I'd agree, that's part of what makes it a great place. Please, don't displace the kids and families that make it so.

I have no idea what you're talking about? Who do you feel is being displaced by the Downtown Grid OR the Gaukel St. plaza?

I don't think anybody will be displaced by the Gaukel street plaza. In my mind, the faster we get on with that, the better. It would suck to add 4X the cars (shown in city's traffic study) at the corner of Charles and Gaukel as a result of the cycling grid, in my opinion. That doesn't take into account new condos not yet occupied or built.
I also think it should be the extension of the Young St cycle path that is currently being routed to Water at Duke in the Grid plan. Just one more block and you'd connect to Gaukel - a street already planned for reconstruction (or so it seems).

The people being displaced will be people living on Linden or David, depending which direction they finally decide to make Joseph. The data is conclusive in the traffic study to show a large increase in drivers on Joseph using side streets to get around traffic. 
That's one thing that finally convinced them to open up Water. (or, at least, differ till tomorrow or some later day)
Even if you can't read the traffic study, I don't know who can, common sense says that the traffic at the light of Joseph and Victoria is going to be a mess (it's worth noting the city hasn't done a traffic study for Joseph going in current design direction yet, so, nobody knows the real impact). In order to get to Courtland and Queen, you have very few options. The other big feeder into downtown is Park. Put all those cars turning left, waiting at that extremely long light, remove the ability to make a right turn because you have a bike lane, and then add in two parking lots coming out of the Tannery (with no right turn option). Add on top of that, that because the street is now a one-way, making a left onto those side streets is equivalent to making a right. 
Traffic is likely (and it is shown in the city's traffic study) to turn down Linden and Heins to get to Jubilee, to avoid waiting forever at that light. In addition, studies show that traffic on one-way streets is faster, more aggressive and less attentive than on two-way. To further amplify the situation at rush hour people stuck in traffic drive more aggressively, faster and less attentively. The cherry on top, add 5000 residents to the downtown and then it's not only a rush hour problem, it happens every time someone wants to go to Home Depot or go see their parents or whatever people want to use a car for. Hamilton has been converting their one-ways to two-ways for years. Better for the environment too. Not sure what advantages there are for one-way streets other than moving cars quickly. Which also goes against putting the cycle path on Joseph. 
The people on Linden, in particular, are seniors and young families living in affordable housing. Have a walk by and ask if they know anything about this.

[panamaniac]

I’m confused.

[kwcc]

Me too, and I wrote it.
I think it's better with hand waving.
Google impacts of one-way streets on neighbourhoods.

[ijmorlan]

Not sure what advantages there are for one-way streets other than moving cars quickly. Which also goes against putting the cycle path on Joseph. 

They can be narrower. You could literally have a curb-to-curb width of 4m if it’s a no parking, no stopping zone. This leaves more space for non-vehicular uses.

[kwcc]

Not sure what advantages there are for one-way streets other than moving cars quickly. Which also goes against putting the cycle path on Joseph. 

They can be narrower. You could literally have a curb-to-curb width of 4m if it’s a no parking, no stopping zone. This leaves more space for non-vehicular uses.

True, good point. That wouldn't apply to Joseph, though. There are a number of houses and commercial accesses. Many accesses will cross the cycle path.

[danbrotherston]

I have no idea what you're talking about? Who do you feel is being displaced by the Downtown Grid OR the Gaukel St. plaza?

I don't think anybody will be displaced by the Gaukel street plaza. In my mind, the faster we get on with that, the better. It would suck to add 4X the cars (shown in city's traffic study) at the corner of Charles and Gaukel as a result of the cycling grid, in my opinion. That doesn't take into account new condos not yet occupied or built.
I also think it should be the extension of the Young St cycle path that is currently being routed to Water at Duke in the Grid plan. Just one more block and you'd connect to Gaukel - a street already planned for reconstruction (or so it seems).

The people being displaced will be people living on Linden or David, depending which direction they finally decide to make Joseph. The data is conclusive in the traffic study to show a large increase in drivers on Joseph using side streets to get around traffic. 
That's one thing that finally convinced them to open up Water. (or, at least, differ till tomorrow or some later day)
Even if you can't read the traffic study, I don't know who can, common sense says that the traffic at the light of Joseph and Victoria is going to be a mess (it's worth noting the city hasn't done a traffic study for Joseph going in current design direction yet, so, nobody knows the real impact). In order to get to Courtland and Queen, you have very few options. The other big feeder into downtown is Park. Put all those cars turning left, waiting at that extremely long light, remove the ability to make a right turn because you have a bike lane, and then add in two parking lots coming out of the Tannery (with no right turn option). Add on top of that, that because the street is now a one-way, making a left onto those side streets is equivalent to making a right. 
Traffic is likely (and it is shown in the city's traffic study) to turn down Linden and Heins to get to Jubilee, to avoid waiting forever at that light. In addition, studies show that traffic on one-way streets is faster, more aggressive and less attentive than on two-way. To further amplify the situation at rush hour people stuck in traffic drive more aggressively, faster and less attentively. The cherry on top, add 5000 residents to the downtown and then it's not only a rush hour problem, it happens every time someone wants to go to Home Depot or go see their parents or whatever people want to use a car for. Hamilton has been converting their one-ways to two-ways for years. Better for the environment too. Not sure what advantages there are for one-way streets other than moving cars quickly. Which also goes against putting the cycle path on Joseph. 
The people on Linden, in particular, are seniors and young families living in affordable housing. Have a walk by and ask if they know anything about this.

*blinks*...umm...how will someone be displaced again?  This makes zero sense, displaced would mean they are leaving their homes.

I'm not sure what traffic you think will be forced onto Linden, which doesn't make any connections, I have no idea what traffic jams you think will occur at Joseph and Queen as a result of less traffic on Joseph, but it suffices to say I think you're wrong.

Joseph being made one way isn't the same as an urban highway, there are lots of one lane one way roads in DTK which aren't a problem, even the street you give as an example.  This road will in fact have a narrow 4 meter curb-to-curb profile.

The fact that the Water St. cul-de-sac has been removed from Jubilee is a huge shame, and frankly, is reason enough for me to consider opposing this plan as state. This is probably one of the most dangerous parts of the park, and this would be a huge improvemnt, and I am frankly, angry that it is gone. As usual selfish ignorant folks scared of change are making our city worse.

These are probably the same assholes who opposed sidewalks on Jubilee.

[kwcc]

I don't think anybody will be displaced by the Gaukel street plaza. In my mind, the faster we get on with that, the better. It would suck to add 4X the cars (shown in city's traffic study) at the corner of Charles and Gaukel as a result of the cycling grid, in my opinion. That doesn't take into account new condos not yet occupied or built.
I also think it should be the extension of the Young St cycle path that is currently being routed to Water at Duke in the Grid plan. Just one more block and you'd connect to Gaukel - a street already planned for reconstruction (or so it seems).

The people being displaced will be people living on Linden or David, depending which direction they finally decide to make Joseph. The data is conclusive in the traffic study to show a large increase in drivers on Joseph using side streets to get around traffic. 
That's one thing that finally convinced them to open up Water. (or, at least, differ till tomorrow or some later day)
Even if you can't read the traffic study, I don't know who can, common sense says that the traffic at the light of Joseph and Victoria is going to be a mess (it's worth noting the city hasn't done a traffic study for Joseph going in current design direction yet, so, nobody knows the real impact). In order to get to Courtland and Queen, you have very few options. The other big feeder into downtown is Park. Put all those cars turning left, waiting at that extremely long light, remove the ability to make a right turn because you have a bike lane, and then add in two parking lots coming out of the Tannery (with no right turn option). Add on top of that, that because the street is now a one-way, making a left onto those side streets is equivalent to making a right. 
Traffic is likely (and it is shown in the city's traffic study) to turn down Linden and Heins to get to Jubilee, to avoid waiting forever at that light. In addition, studies show that traffic on one-way streets is faster, more aggressive and less attentive than on two-way. To further amplify the situation at rush hour people stuck in traffic drive more aggressively, faster and less attentively. The cherry on top, add 5000 residents to the downtown and then it's not only a rush hour problem, it happens every time someone wants to go to Home Depot or go see their parents or whatever people want to use a car for. Hamilton has been converting their one-ways to two-ways for years. Better for the environment too. Not sure what advantages there are for one-way streets other than moving cars quickly. Which also goes against putting the cycle path on Joseph. 
The people on Linden, in particular, are seniors and young families living in affordable housing. Have a walk by and ask if they know anything about this.

*blinks*...umm...how will someone be displaced again?  This makes zero sense, displaced would mean they are leaving their homes.

I'm not sure what traffic you think will be forced onto Linden, which doesn't make any connections, I have no idea what traffic jams you think will occur at Joseph and Queen as a result of less traffic on Joseph, but it suffices to say I think you're wrong.

Joseph being made one way isn't the same as an urban highway, there are lots of one lane one way roads in DTK which aren't a problem, even the street you give as an example.  This road will in fact have a narrow 4 meter curb-to-curb profile.

The fact that the Water St. cul-de-sac has been removed from Jubilee is a huge shame, and frankly, is reason enough for me to consider opposing this plan as state. This is probably one of the most dangerous parts of the park, and this would be a huge improvemnt, and I am frankly, angry that it is gone. As usual selfish ignorant folks scared of change are making our city worse.

These are probably the same assholes who opposed sidewalks on Jubilee.

You don't have to trust my word. Come to the meeting on Monday at 930 and ask the city what they anticipate will happen. 
They're not hiding it. 
You continue to exercise your privilege.

[danbrotherston]

*blinks*...umm...how will someone be displaced again?  This makes zero sense, displaced would mean they are leaving their homes.

I'm not sure what traffic you think will be forced onto Linden, which doesn't make any connections, I have no idea what traffic jams you think will occur at Joseph and Queen as a result of less traffic on Joseph, but it suffices to say I think you're wrong.

Joseph being made one way isn't the same as an urban highway, there are lots of one lane one way roads in DTK which aren't a problem, even the street you give as an example.  This road will in fact have a narrow 4 meter curb-to-curb profile.

The fact that the Water St. cul-de-sac has been removed from Jubilee is a huge shame, and frankly, is reason enough for me to consider opposing this plan as state. This is probably one of the most dangerous parts of the park, and this would be a huge improvemnt, and I am frankly, angry that it is gone. As usual selfish ignorant folks scared of change are making our city worse.

These are probably the same assholes who opposed sidewalks on Jubilee.

You don't have to trust my word. Come to the meeting on Monday at 930 and ask the city what they anticipate will happen. 
They're not hiding it. 
You continue to exercise your privilege.

I'm not asking council, I'm asking you how you think people will be forced out of their homes. Your argument makes no sense.

Complaining about my privilege doesn't hide that.