General Road and Highway Discussion

[Bob_McBob]

Kitchener is currently installing contentious speed bumps on Glasgow between Fischer-Hallman and Westmount, the "upscale" section that already has a 40km/h limit and chicanes and medians to calm traffic. Residents lobbied hard for the speed bumps, and the city caved despite the fire department's protests and their own policy about traffic calming on major collectors.

Summary on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/waterloo/commen...kitchener/

[DHLawrence]

Sounds like west Galt.

[danbrotherston]

This is one of the clearest indications of money buying political clout in the city.

[MidTowner]

Sometimes good things trickle down. If another street where street calming would be justified in the real world, but not by the city's policies, can point to Glasgow and say that exceptions are made, that's a positive, I think.

I have a specific trip I take from time to time, usually on Sunday evenings, to visit someone who lives in Westvale. I take Glasgow its entire length for this trip and, when I do, I drive the speed limit. There is usually a queue of motorists tailgating each other behind me by the time I get to Fischer-Hallman, the first of which often glares at me when we pull up alongside each other there.

I only say that to say it's meaningless when the poster on reddit says the street "already has a 40km/h limit." I'm glad that some apparently influential people have learned that speed limits are useless and redesign is what really works.

[jamincan]

Speed bumps are the worst possible form of traffic calming, though. There are much better ways it can be accomplished.

[panamaniac]

This is one of the clearest indications of money buying political clout in the city.

That particular example is of very long standing.

[danbrotherston]

This street is especially offensive to me as virtually every house has a lawn care service and every single one of them park in the bike lanes. The road has bike lanes but at certain times of the year, they are available exactly 0% of the time. Plus the current traffic calming is very dangerous for cyclists. I was nearly hit by a truck that swerved into the bike lanes to get around the islands without slowing down, at this point, downhill, I usually take the lane, do 50 km/h and still get angrily passed.

Plus all the people running or walking in the bike lane who can't use the sidewalk which doesn't exist, and all the homeowners like to place their garbage and recycling in the roadway.

Not to mention I was hit at the intersection of Glasgow and Fischer-Hallman.

Yeah, I'm probably biased, but I have no love for the street or it's residents.

[highlander]

Can someone explain how money is involved here? Are we saying because they pay a lot of property tax they have more influence or is it some other mechanism?

[Viewfromthe42]

I believe they are suggesting that council is pandering to their unjustified needs (using city money wastefully) to buy votes.

[danbrotherston]

I believe they are suggesting that council is pandering to their unjustified needs (using city money wastefully) to buy votes.

We have to define "buy votes" though, because the people there have just the same individual vote as a less wealthy person.

It is being suggested by me and others, that the politicians pay more attention to these people based on their wealth, so it is a valid question of "why".  To be honest, I don't really know, maybe these people contribute to campaigns, i.e., buying signs, or maybe it is just that these people have the means to make trouble for local politicians.  I'm not sure.   But I can see a pattern.

[tomh009]

Speed bumps are the worst possible form of traffic calming, though. There are much better ways it can be accomplished.

Will they actually be bumps or humps?  The former are far worse than the latter.

[robdrimmie]

My impression of that stretch of Glasgow is that the residents are not just considerably wealthy, but also very well connected. I don't know specific connections, but they're the sort of people who are actively engaged community members. They are in the various social clubs, on boards of community events and regional organizations. They participate in big community events. They golf together at the exclusive club on that stretch of road.

For the most part I don't think these are particularly bad people, and they are likely responsible for quite a lot of good in our community but they're also quite happy to leverage their networks to resist the fact that that stretch of road is not a quiet neighbourhood street but a very useful through path from one of the heavier suburban areas into the downtown core.

[danbrotherston]

My impression of that stretch of Glasgow is that the residents are not just considerably wealthy, but also very well connected. I don't know specific connections, but they're the sort of people who are actively engaged community members. They are in the various social clubs, on boards of community events and regional organizations. They participate in big community events. They golf together at the exclusive club on that stretch of road.

For the most part I don't think these are particularly bad people, and they are likely responsible for quite a lot of good in our community but they're also quite happy to leverage their networks to resist the fact that that stretch of road is not a quiet neighbourhood street but a very useful through path from one of the heavier suburban areas into the downtown core.

"Bad people"...no that's a value judgement.  But as you say, they do enjoy outsized political clout, and they're happy to use it.  They also seem to act with an air of entitlement about their (through) road (which is certainly not unique in our region).

Whether you consider these things bad traits or not, and whether those few traits are reflective of a person as a whole, is a value judgement, but objectively those traits seem to be true.

The end result however, is that there is that the road is getting less safe for cyclists, and worse, there is a sense of unfairness to it which undermines confidence in our system of government.

[ end of rant ]

[tomh009]

The end result however, is that there is that the road is getting less safe for cyclists

If the cars end up driving slower, I should think that would be an improvement for cyclist safety. Subject to the specific implementation of speed bumps/humps, of course.

[danbrotherston]

The end result however, is that there is that the road is getting less safe for cyclists

If the cars end up driving slower, I should think that would be an improvement for cyclist safety. Subject to the specific implementation of speed bumps/humps, of course.

I haven't seen the speed bump implementation, I was actually referring to the island/bike lane obstruction situation that is there currently.  Cars are probably traveling somewhat slower, but mostly they are simply swerving in and out of the bike lanes.  In addition going downhill at 40-50 km/h means I don't particularly want to bump up over the curb, which means taking the lane instead of using the bike lane.

So yes, slower is better, but other parts are worse.  It is honestly nerve wracking riding up the hill in the bike lanes beside the traffic islands listening to cars coming up the hill behind you, wondering which ones are going to slow down and be careful, and which aren't.