ION - Waterloo Region's Light Rail Transit

[jeffster]

We've known since November it wasn't in the region's budget until 2019.

http://www.waterlooregionconnected.com/s...5#pid45035

This is some sort of priority that the city/region needs to move up somehow. Really, there should be two crossings, in my opinion, but at least one close to Food Basics.

You'd have thought the geniuses who planned all this in the first place would have thought of this scenario. But alas, the elite don't disappoint.

I think, for now, a good alternative would be is to have a shuttle bus doing a loop in that area. Though I imagine that would be fairly expensive, even if you limited the hours, you're looking at probably $250,000/year still at least. I base that on an assumption of 12 hours a day for 5 days, and 10 hours for Saturday and Sunday, so 80-hours per week, which is 2 FT employees, plus bus expenses. Or alternatively, they could have an on-demand type of taxi service with some sort of micro-bus, privately run.

[Canard]

I can imagine that the planing was done by maps from people who don’t live here, in offices that are in another city (or country).

[plam]

This is some sort of priority that the city/region needs to move up somehow. Really, there should be two crossings, in my opinion, but at least one close to Food Basics.

You'd have thought the geniuses who planned all this in the first place would have thought of this scenario.  But alas, the elite don't disappoint.  

I think, for now, a good alternative would be is to have a shuttle bus doing a loop in that area.  Though I imagine that would be fairly expensive, even if you limited the hours, you're looking at probably $250,000/year still at least. I base that on an assumption of 12 hours a day for 5 days, and 10 hours for Saturday and Sunday, so 80-hours per week, which is 2 FT employees, plus bus expenses. Or alternatively, they could have an on-demand type of taxi service with some sort of micro-bus, privately run.

That sounds like an uncalled-for potshot at those who were doing the planning. As Canard writes, those who were planning were probably not familiar with the situation on the ground. This is why we do public consultations these days (and part of the reason it takes longer to build infrastructure here than in less-democratic countries). Unfortunately, certain demographics are used to not being consulted (because they usually aren't), so it takes effort from the whole of society to be inclusive.

I do agree that there should be a solution sooner rather than later. Shuttle buses and micro taxis sound like a good way to spend a bunch of money without necessarily getting good results. Would you want to wait for a shuttle bus? How do you call the micro taxi? Perhaps it would be less expensive to just pay for a crossing guard.

[KevinL]

Good advocacy from the mayor. https://twitter.com/berryonline/status/1...3677222913

[creative]

I forgot, what is the definition of "the elite"?

[ijmorlan]

This is some sort of priority that the city/region needs to move up somehow. Really, there should be two crossings, in my opinion, but at least one close to Food Basics.

You'd have thought the geniuses who planned all this in the first place would have thought of this scenario.  But alas, the elite don't disappoint.  

I think, for now, a good alternative would be is to have a shuttle bus doing a loop in that area.  Though I imagine that would be fairly expensive, even if you limited the hours, you're looking at probably $250,000/year still at least. I base that on an assumption of 12 hours a day for 5 days, and 10 hours for Saturday and Sunday, so 80-hours per week, which is 2 FT employees, plus bus expenses. Or alternatively, they could have an on-demand type of taxi service with some sort of micro-bus, privately run.

That sounds like an uncalled-for potshot at those who were doing the planning. As Canard writes, those who were planning were probably not familiar with the situation on the ground. This is why we do public consultations these days (and part of the reason it takes longer to build infrastructure here than in less-democratic countries). Unfortunately, certain demographics are used to not being consulted (because they usually aren't), so it takes effort from the whole of society to be inclusive.

I do agree that there should be a solution sooner rather than later. Shuttle buses and micro taxis sound like a good way to spend a bunch of money without necessarily getting good results. Would you want to wait for a shuttle bus? How do you call the micro taxi? Perhaps it would be less expensive to just pay for a crossing guard.

Between Regional staff and Grandlinq, I consider this a major screw-up. It doesn’t take a genius to glance at an aerial view, see the informal accesses, and notice that the plan so far leaves an enormously long stretch of track with no crossing. The various site visits that presumably preceded detailed design also should have turned up the knowledge of the existence of those informal accesses. The fact that those accesses were all de jure trespassing is irrelevant, and anybody who doesn’t understand that has no business being employed in planning.

And yes, there definitely should be two or even three crossings, not just one, and paved multi-use trails on both sides of the tracks all the way along. If this is infeasible now it is only because they screwed up earlier (e.g., because of the choice of the exact location of the tracks and buried hydro infrastructure, either of which would be very expensive to move now but which could have been trivially adjusted during planning). All of this should have been obvious to the people making the detailed decisions. I can excuse an initial draft by Grandlinq that ignored some of these considerations, but the fact that it wasn’t caught and corrected before construction is intolerable.

I think I’ve also seen suggestions that a grade-separated crossing should be considered. While this is not a bad idea, any suggestion that there is a safety problem with grade crossings is bogus. If that were actually believed to be true, we would have built an elevated system, possibly a monorail.

[clasher]

That entire stretch was a stone-dust trail so someone should have realized that there was some official trail capacity being removed and not accommodated anywhere else, even if someone chose to ignore the informal crossings that existed. I agree there should be more than one crossing too... pretty much no excuse for it. No reason that the entire line couldn't have been walked through before construction.

I also think they need to formalize the crossing that still sort of exists just west of the Manitou/Courtland/Fairway intersection... the city could pony up some money since they want to build a bicycle network, the manitou lanes end here and just dump riders into an area with no infrastructure and heavy traffic.

[Canard]

CTV's take:

https://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1439197

[Bureaucromancer]

Honestly, it's one thing that this happened in the first place, but who on earth is authorizing the signs trying to enforce the fencing?!? It takes a special kind of person to be aware of the issue, hear that there is a plan for a crossing and then decide to put up freaking "restricted area" signs.

[Canard]

It's an unfortunate situation, and even more unfortunate that the decision makers have known about it for years now, and progress has been so slow...

...but it doesn't change the fact that testing must continue, and trains will be blowing by here at 70 km/h on a more frequent basis - and people have simply got to stop crossing, or they'll risk getting killed.

Or, we have to stop testing and delay opening. Take your pick.

For what it's worth, any time I've seen testing through there, one of the OnTrack Safety guys is positioned at the "hole", presumably making sure nobody tries to cross when the train is about to go by.

[jeffster]

I forgot, what is the definition of "the elite"?

A size of letter in typewriting, with 12 characters to the inch.

Or, you can refer to the most powerful, rich, or talented people within a particular group, place, or society as the elite, or you could say a select part of a group that is superior to the rest in terms of ability or qualities.

Amazing what you can find on Google.

And these were the people who were creating a $700+ million dollar decision, without any care or thought to anyone who may have been negatively affected by such construction of the LRT, in an unneeded way. Had these people paid any attention to detail, any attention to the people living in that area, and had any ability to put themselves into other peoples shoes, this pedestrian crossing would have been put in place before testing of the LRT and before the fence was installed. It would have been part of the design.

I realize that this sounds blunt, but that's exactly what this was, and is. But the people who were heading this, that 'cream of the crop', goes home every night, in their luxury automobile, to their large homes, because they really didn't care.

I'm not bitter of these, I drive a car, own my home, have a .gov job, though not close to 'elite' level. I just feel that once again, those in charge, failed to do their job properly, and at something that most clowns would have thought of.

[jeffster]

It's an unfortunate situation, and even more unfortunate that the decision makers have known about it for years now, and progress has been so slow...

...but it doesn't change the fact that testing must continue, and trains will be blowing by here at 70 km/h on a more frequent basis - and people have simply got to stop crossing, or they'll risk getting killed.

Or, we have to stop testing and delay opening.  Take your pick.

For what it's worth, any time I've seen testing through there, one of the OnTrack Safety guys is positioned at the "hole", presumably making sure nobody tries to cross when the train is about to go by.

For what it's worth, if they can build a huge bridge over a highway (like what's has happened over the 401) in a relatively short time, doing a pedestrian bridge over a couple tracks of the railway shouldn't be that difficult. Without affecting testing. They just need to be motivated or have someone light a fire under their ass.

[Canard]

They missed one area. Many others have crossings (Quiet Place, Waterloo Park, the University). It sucks, but it's not like they intentionally said "Welp, how can we screw people?"

[jeffster]

That sounds like an uncalled-for potshot at those who were doing the planning. As Canard writes, those who were planning were probably not familiar with the situation on the ground. This is why we do public consultations these days (and part of the reason it takes longer to build infrastructure here than in less-democratic countries). Unfortunately, certain demographics are used to not being consulted (because they usually aren't), so it takes effort from the whole of society to be inclusive.

I do agree that there should be a solution sooner rather than later. Shuttle buses and micro taxis sound like a good way to spend a bunch of money without necessarily getting good results. Would you want to wait for a shuttle bus? How do you call the micro taxi? Perhaps it would be less expensive to just pay for a crossing guard.

It was a potshot, however, it was also called for. And really, there was no excuse for them not being familiar with the situation. That's why they're paid the 'big bucks'.

I would imagine if had one bus, it wouldn't take long for it to do one loop, as long as it only made right-hand turns. Maybe every 20 minutes? You'd only need a couple stops along Fairway Rd, after all, they'd have to walk some distance before all this.

And I said micro-bus, not micro-taxi. It would be a similar service the region has now with their MobilityPLUS. So it could be scheduled for pick-up and drop-off. There are solutions that the region could implement right away, they just need to figure that out.

[ijmorlan]

...but it doesn't change the fact that testing must continue, and trains will be blowing by here at 70 km/h on a more frequent basis - and people have simply got to stop crossing, or they'll risk getting killed.

Utter nonsense. It is way safer to cross the LRT tracks than to cross Union at the Spur Line trail, or Park at the Iron Horse, or several other locations I can think of where there is an unprotected crossing of a road by an official path. The danger comes from idiots who can’t be bothered to wait a few seconds and cross after the train rather than before it; for normal, reasonably prudent people, it’s not a dangerous crossing at all. Even without crossing protection, it’s a straight track with excellent visibility. Furthermore, because LRVs are so short (unlike long freight trains), there is little temptation to attempt to beat them to the crossing.

I’ve said it before and I’ll probably say it again. Trains aren’t magically dangerous; the danger comes from being hit by them. They can only be in certain places; and it’s easy, in this case, to see when they will be there.

I’m glad to hear there is apparently a hole in the fence. A people who can’t disobey enough to cross a train line where there should be, but is not, an official crossing is a people who can’t disobey enough to resist tyranny.