Superlinx

[rangersfan]

An idea that would see 11 public transit systems ( including Waterloo Region) integrated into one larger system.

http://www.570news.com/2017/11/29/new-pl...-response/

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/kitch...-1.4422467



One thing that I would love to see is a unified fare system, or if you bought a transit pass it would work for any system in Ontario.

[Bob_McBob]

"New plan to integrate GTA and Waterloo Region transit networks met with luke warm response"

Sounds promising 

[Canard]

I would also love to see a unified system. Anxious to see what the “Superlinx” logo would look like! I love the new ML branding.

[SammyOES]

A unified fare system is a great idea and could probably work without everything being under one big umbrella.

Have to say though that I agree with Ken Seiling:

"Our real concerns are with our rail linkages and GO Train linkages with Toronto and that’s already covered off by Metrolinx, we already have an organization that is doing that and working on that, so I don’t see how a super large body would advance that.” said Seiling.

Seiling says he is also concerned about local issues taking a back seat to Toronto issues, “I think there is a risk that the whole plan to build more subways in Toronto and some of the problems they have in the GTA would put at risk some of the issue we have to deal with.”

[KevinL]

This would only have a chance of working IF it is truly separate from political influence, at either the provincial or municipal level. Otherwise, as Ken Seiling says, one region or project can sway things too far.

Metrolinx is already too heavily influenced by the political winds; let's get that fixed before we dream bigger.

[plam]

A unified fare system is a great idea and could probably work without everything being under one big umbrella.

Have to say though that I agree with Ken Seiling:

"Our real concerns are with our rail linkages and GO Train linkages with Toronto and that’s already covered off by Metrolinx, we already have an organization that is doing that and working on that, so I don’t see how a super large body would advance that.” said Seiling.

Seiling says he is also concerned about local issues taking a back seat to Toronto issues, “I think there is a risk that the whole plan to build more subways in Toronto and some of the problems they have in the GTA would put at risk some of the issue we have to deal with.”

Yes. Unified fares do work in Switzerland, but then again everything works in Switzerland. I'm not thrilled with Toronto dominating our transit system. But it's the Toronto Board of Trade, so it's just probably something that people would talk about but no one would actually implement.

[tomh009]

A unified fare system is a great idea and could probably work without everything being under one big umbrella.

Yes. Unified fares do work in Switzerland, but then again everything works in Switzerland. I'm not thrilled with Toronto dominating our transit system. But it's the Toronto Board of Trade, so it's just probably something that people would talk about but no one would actually implement.

It doesn't need to be unified fares, all we need is a unified fare system so that my stored-value fare card will work anywhere. Ideally on any transit system in Ontario, plus GO, VIA and any government-licensed bus lines (such as Greyhound). It's not rocket science, and it can actually save operation costs rather than increasing them. And no one needs to lose control.

In the Tokyo area (population nearly 40M) the big railways use SUICA, while the subways and small independent local trains use PASMO. But the two cards are completely interchangeable, and you can both use and recharge both cards anywhere.

[plam]

It doesn't need to be unified fares, all we need is a unified fare system so that my stored-value fare card will work anywhere. Ideally on any transit system in Ontario, plus GO, VIA and any government-licensed bus lines (such as Greyhound). It's not rocket science, and it can actually save operation costs rather than increasing them. And no one needs to lose control.

In the Tokyo area (population nearly 40M) the big railways use SUICA, while the subways and small independent local trains use PASMO. But the two cards are completely interchangeable, and you can both use and recharge both cards anywhere.

I thought that was the vision behind PRESTO (implementation, of course, being a whole other story).

VIA's a bit tricky in that you buy tickets in advance. But there's no reason such a thing shouldn't exist otherwise.

[MidTowner]

A unified fare system is a great idea and could probably work without everything being under one big umbrella.

Have to say though that I agree with Ken Seiling:

"Our real concerns are with our rail linkages and GO Train linkages with Toronto and that’s already covered off by Metrolinx, we already have an organization that is doing that and working on that, so I don’t see how a super large body would advance that.” said Seiling.

Seiling says he is also concerned about local issues taking a back seat to Toronto issues, “I think there is a risk that the whole plan to build more subways in Toronto and some of the problems they have in the GTA would put at risk some of the issue we have to deal with.”

Yes. Unified fares do work in Switzerland, but then again everything works in Switzerland. I'm not thrilled with Toronto dominating our transit system. But it's the Toronto Board of Trade, so it's just probably something that people would talk about but no one would actually implement.

That sounds about right. Despite the fancy name, this is a big Chamber of Commerce doing some spit-balling. It doesn't have to be realistic. This idea isn't. A strong case could probably be made for it, but politically it's pretty unlikely.

[tomh009]

I thought that was the vision behind PRESTO (implementation, of course, being a whole other story).

VIA's a bit tricky in that you buy tickets in advance. But there's no reason such a thing shouldn't exist otherwise.

Right. But we don't have PRESTO -- are we the only ones to reject it?

You could still allow on-the-spot VIA purchases using PRESTO (or similar system), the pre-purchased paper tickets would work in parallel. It's the same in Japan, you can purchase paper tickets or use your SUICA/PASMO.

[plam]

I thought that was the vision behind PRESTO (implementation, of course, being a whole other story).

VIA's a bit tricky in that you buy tickets in advance. But there's no reason such a thing shouldn't exist otherwise.

Right.  But we don't have PRESTO -- are we the only ones to reject it?

You could still allow on-the-spot VIA purchases using PRESTO (or similar system), the pre-purchased paper tickets would work in parallel.  It's the same in Japan, you can purchase paper tickets or use your SUICA/PASMO.

My impression is that Ontario basically strongarmed many GTHA agencies + OC Transpo into using PRESTO. Presto's Wikipedia page contains the list of agencies using it and not using it. Guelph doesn't use it.

On-the-spot VIA purchases are super expensive. They've moved towards dynamic (airline-style) pricing. You could pay on the spot but you probably don't want to. This is not like Swiss railway tickets where you don't need to buy ahead of time.

[MacBerry]

Yes. Unified fares do work in Switzerland, but then again everything works in Switzerland. I'm not thrilled with Toronto dominating our transit system. But it's the Toronto Board of Trade, so it's just probably something that people would talk about but no one would actually implement.

That sounds about right. Despite the fancy name, this is a big Chamber of Commerce doing some spit-balling. It doesn't have to be realistic. This idea isn't. A strong case could probably be made for it, but politically it's pretty unlikely.

"A strong case could probably be made for it, but politically it's pretty unlikely"  UNTIL after the 2018 elections Municipal and Provincial ... then all bets are off about not happening.

[SammyOES]

Is there really a strong case for it?

It just feels like the needs of each area are fairly independent and local transit needs to be in sync with local planning to actually be effective. And how does funding work? Is each area still funded independently + with their own fares? If so, you're not reducing a whole lot of overhead. If not, you're introducing a whole host of other problems.

There's definitely a strong case for co-operation and standardization (for example the Region jumping on the Metrolinx order), but I think that can be done without a whole new big organization on top. And ultimately, can't the Provice be that layer when necessary?

[Canard]

This reminds me a lot of the theme-park industry.

Each park operates in a unique geographic environment. Sometimes, they’re independently owned. Sometimes, there is a big parent company that is far removed, and had no idea what’s going on. Do admission revenues go into a big pit for all parks? What if one park always gets all the big investments?

Canada’s Wonderland is actually the highest attended seasonal theme park in North America (ie, the Florida and California parks pull more folks, because they’re open year-round), but the investment back into the park doesn’t necessarily reflect that. Cedar Fair has the money and spreads it out to their other parks where it’s needed.

Imagine if suddenly we were all paying for Toronto’s DRL, instead of an extension to Cambridge, with our fares here?