St. Patrick's celebrations

[Smore]

I think this event grew in popularity because it is illegal.  It is exhilarating to drink unlawfully in public along with thousands of others.   It's a bit like a riot or a mob.  People do things they wouldn't do by themselves.  Normalizing this event would attract very few people.  They already have the choice to go to a bar or pub to drink green beer and some people do that.  But nobody gets bused in to Waterloo to go to a pup or to drink in a sanctioned beer tent.  That's not the point!  Besides, most of the time the 17th falls on a school day and it's not something the student union or administration would favour.

This, plus the main downfall of the official events is that Ezra allows underage drinking - nothing legally hosted would.

[jgsz]

No more street party on Ezra for St. Patrick’s Day, says police chief

Larkin won't say how many uniformed and plain-clothes officers will be on the streets but at this week's police services board meeting, board members approved a plan to bring in the public safety unit from Peel Regional Police.

That means in addition to local officers, police from Peel Regional will be on hand that date.

It's the first time local police have asked for help from another police service.

This year's street party went on as usual despite efforts by the police to contain it.  Crowds were larger than last year and it may be larger next year when St. Patrick's Day falls on a Sunday.  So what is the community to do?

There is already a petition to stop the party.  The police could get tougher next year by bringing out billy clubs, water cannons and tear gas.  But there are alternatives.

Why not embrace the event the way Port Dover welcomes bikers on Friday the 13th?  Or the way the authorities in Montreal turn a blind eye to people openly smoking marijuana at the Sunday Tam Tam's?  Police will remove anyone who is intoxicated and harassing other people. 

For example, authorities could have more control on Ezra Street if there were information booths set up by the police, universities, businesses, etc.  There could be some food trucks.  Small beer tents could also be set up and they would be able to refuse serving anyone who is drunk or unruly.  

The event could be tamed if it was co-opted.  It might be worth a try.

[panamaniac]

One wonders how many tens of thousands of dollars this foolishness costs the Region/City in emergency and other services each year?

[Pheidippides]

One wonders how many tens of thousands of dollars this foolishness costs the Region/City in emergency and other services each year?

$120,000 in 2017.

Those are just the direct police costs (not paramedic).

That doesn't include the burden on the emergency room (and the effects on other patients).

The detours and delays on the GRT (and its passengers).

The damages to property, future insurance costs because of the streets reputation, etc.


There will be no easy solution to this. It is going to take a societal shift in attitudes around alcohol.

[panamaniac]

I wrote "tens of thousands" wondering in the back of my mind whether it could possibly be "hundreds of thousands". Shocking.

[Pheidippides]

CTV said there were at least 52 hospitalizations, 15 of which were serious, and 1 ICU stay. A standard hospital stay in Ontario costs $5,364 and ICU stay is about 3x that of a general ward bed. That's another $289,656 of everyone's tax dollars at work, all completely preventable.

[panamaniac]

According to 570 News, 619 charges were laid, including 18 criminal charges.

[ijmorlan]

CTV said there were at least 52 hospitalizations, 15 of which were serious, and 1 ICU stay. A standard hospital stay in Ontario costs $5,364 and ICU stay is about 3x that of a general ward bed. That's another $289,656 of everyone's tax dollars at work, all completely preventable.

My question would be how much of this is created by the event, and how much just moved around. I mean those 52 hospitalizations might have gotten themselves drunk closer to home if they hadn’t come to Ezra St.

Of course it’s still a problem but it’s not totally clear to me that you can really attribute all of it to the specific location of the party.

[jordan2423]

I understand it costs the city money for an event like this, but perhaps they should see how much profit they make due to increased tourism. These thousands of students from out of town definitely helped local businesses, buying food, staying at hotels. So I'm most definitely certain we made a bunch of money off that.

[chutten]

I understand it costs the city money for an event like this, but perhaps they should see how much profit they make due to increased tourism. These thousands of students from out of town definitely helped local businesses, buying food, staying at hotels. So I'm most definitely certain we made a bunch of money off that.

As a wealth transfer from public institutions to private pockets, though. Generally that is frowned upon unless it has a public good (see related: roads).

[jordan2423]

I understand it costs the city money for an event like this, but perhaps they should see how much profit they make due to increased tourism. These thousands of students from out of town definitely helped local businesses, buying food, staying at hotels. So I'm most definitely certain we made a bunch of money off that.

As a wealth transfer from public institutions to private pockets, though. Generally that is frowned upon unless it has a public good (see related: roads).

Oktoberfest is an event where most if not all the money goes towards private pockets. So I don't get what your point is. I can't think of anything anywhere in any city where an event directly helps public institutions.

[tomh009]

I understand it costs the city money for an event like this, but perhaps they should see how much profit they make due to increased tourism. These thousands of students from out of town definitely helped local businesses, buying food, staying at hotels. So I'm most definitely certain we made a bunch of money off that.

I suspect not a lot. Anecdotal evidence points to out-of-town students staying with friends. And clearly liquor was not bought at bars.

That's not to say that they couldn't turn this into a legitimate event that should hopefully encourage people to drink in licensed areas, and to have real businesses selling food and drinks (think of something like ribfest, for example). One huge challenge is he underage people (and many university students are under 19 now that grade 13 is no more): I can't think offhand of a way to engage them in a legal event.

[chutten]

You know, I always thought that Oktoberfest wouldn't cost the city any more than usual, but you're almost certainly right. In terms of cost:benefit I presume there's a difference in degree (but not kind) with St. Patrick's Day, but I don't know how much.

[jeffster]

As a wealth transfer from public institutions to private pockets, though. Generally that is frowned upon unless it has a public good (see related: roads).

Oktoberfest is an event where most if not all the money goes towards private pockets. So I don't get what your point is. I can't think of anything anywhere in any city where an event directly helps public institutions.

I guess the question is, how much money and other benefits does the Oktoberfest bring into the region vs this St. Patrick's Day party. Almost certainly no one benefits from this 1-day event on Ezra.

For example, Oktoberfest raises $1.5M a year for non-profit organization. Ezra event is $0.
Oktoberfest doesn't allow underage drinking, Ezra does.
Economic benefit of Oktoberfest is $22M+/year. Ezra, pretty much unknown, but most likely pretty close to $0. That $22M translates into jobs, btw. We're pretty much certain the only jobs created by the Ezra event is OT for emergency services in the area, plus work for people OUTSIDE the region, as we had to hire reinforcements from Peel region.

It's unlikely the Ezra St event would ever be made official. It's a time for under agers and young adults to drink illegally (and other stuff) on the streets and pass out. Making it official would probably kill the event all together, or at least make it very small.

I do believe that at some point, though, things are going to get to out of hand and it will be banned outright.

Amazing that our police guy Larkin thought they'd control it better this year...he's off on pretty much everything.

[ijmorlan]

I do believe that at some point, though, things are going to get to out of hand and it will be banned outright.

Amazing that our police guy Larkin thought they'd control it better this year...he's off on pretty much everything.

I’m not sure what “banned outright” is supposed to mean. It’s perfectly legal to have a party, and to walk around the neighbourhood. I suppose they could take a hard line on inspecting people for drinking on the street but I understand they already handed out hundreds of tickets this time around. So what would be different?

As to controlling it better, I’d say that having the weekend end with no riots and no controversy about police action counts as a success. I suppose you could say that keeping the road open would have been good.