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+--- Thread: Toronto transit projects (/showthread.php?tid=527)
RE: Toronto transit projects - timc - 12-21-2017
I don't see it as disgusting. The business relationship hasn't been working, so they've agreed to a new contract that is more in line with reality. Both sides get something out of it, and maybe it is a path to a better future.
RE: Toronto transit projects - KevinL - 12-21-2017
There had to be another shoe drop when the Alstom order was announced - this is it. I can't say I'm too surprised.
RE: Toronto transit projects - tomh009 - 12-21-2017
The end result is that the BBD trains will cost about $5M per vehicle, as compared to about $4M originally. Metrolinx is paying Alstom about $8M per vehicle, but I don't know whether that's a valid comparison.
RE: Toronto transit projects - Viewfromthe42 - 12-21-2017
(12-21-2017, 12:25 PM)Canard Wrote: Disgusting.
https://t.co/MaFxxb8Oun?amp=1
I recently had a friend at a German startup interview a German Bombardier employee. He effectively described himself as one of the very highly qualified and pleasant rats fleeing the burning, sinking ship, seeing a four person startup as much more appealing, safe, and rewarding than a senior position within Bombardier. Take that for what you will. I just keep imagining this like Leia talking to Tarkin in Star Wars A New Hope: "The more you (the Bombardier family) tighten your grip, the more star systems (business opportunities) will slip through your fingers."
RE: Toronto transit projects - tomh009 - 12-21-2017
Then again, you hear horror stories from employees at all kinds of companies, including highly-respected ones like Amazon or Google. I would hesitate to draw a direct correlation between an individual employee's experience and the company's future prospects.
RE: Toronto transit projects - Viewfromthe42 - 12-21-2017
Usually about the ship being ruthless or cutthroat, less so about the ship going down in flames. But indeed, just one data point anecdote I thought I'd share.
From Bombardier's perspective, they now get the same money for higher margin services (operating rather than building things), whereas for Toronto, they get something from Bombardier (operating) that's hard to screw up rather than something they neither need as many of nor expect Bombardier to be able to even deliver reliably (LRVs).
Sounds sad, but honestly isn't this a win-win?
RE: Toronto transit projects - Canard - 12-21-2017
Yep, keep in mind there all sorts of sides.
Bombardier Millhaven (Kingston) is a totally different beast from Thunder Bay. The crown jewel in the chain in North America, for sure. Until getting thrown into the FLEXITY Fiasco that Metrolinx has absolutely made a mess of, they have never been late on a project. Ever. They are the plant that turns shit around. And you're going to see a lot more proof of that in the new year.
RE: Toronto transit projects - Canard - 03-17-2018
Twice in 6 days. Time for a gate:
http://toronto.citynews.ca/2018/03/17/car-found-past-queens-quay-station-streetcar-tunnel/
RE: Toronto transit projects - clasher - 03-18-2018
The intersection design is kind of bad but I think they do need to install some of those retractable bollards that are popular in Europe... at least we'd end up with some good videos of people trashing their cars, and most of the wrecks can be cleared quickly since they aren't on the tracks down in the tunnel.
RE: Toronto transit projects - timio - 03-18-2018
As long as the gates don't have the same motor problems as the fare gates...
RE: Toronto transit projects - ijmorlan - 03-18-2018
(03-18-2018, 09:04 AM)clasher Wrote: The intersection design is kind of bad but I think they do need to install some of those retractable bollards that are popular in Europe... at least we'd end up with some good videos of people trashing their cars, and most of the wrecks can be cleared quickly since they aren't on the tracks down in the tunnel.
Retractable bollards do seem like a good idea. I would like to know why they don’t explore non-embedded track — the track is embedded all the way down the ramp and only transitions to non-embedded inside the tunnel. If it were non-embedded from somewhere short of the ramp, it would make it significantly harder to enter the tunnel with a regular vehicle. There could even be a trap on the ramp where the floor falls away and the rails are supported on steel beams for a distance of a few metres, so that the only possible way for a vehicle to enter the tunnel would be to balance on the rails themselves. Doesn’t really solve the problem but makes clearing stuck cars much much faster and possibly able to be done by a regular tow truck.
I would also want to know how people get misdirected. Do they turn into the wrong right-of-way at the previous intersection (York St.) or do they mount the curb from Queens Quay into the streetcar right-of-way? The latter could be eliminated with a line of regular, non-moving bollards.
Finally, somebody please tell me that the TTC has a lien on the vehicle against their costs. It would be insane if somebody could drive their vehicle in there, force the TTC to incur thousands of dollars in costs, and then just get their vehicle back with nothing but a few dents and a fine. They should have a non-dischargeable-in-bankruptcy debt owed to the TTC secured by their vehicle for the full amount of the TTC’s costs.
RE: Toronto transit projects - danbrotherston - 03-18-2018
(03-18-2018, 12:20 PM)ijmorlan Wrote:(03-18-2018, 09:04 AM)clasher Wrote: The intersection design is kind of bad but I think they do need to install some of those retractable bollards that are popular in Europe... at least we'd end up with some good videos of people trashing their cars, and most of the wrecks can be cleared quickly since they aren't on the tracks down in the tunnel.
Retractable bollards do seem like a good idea. I would like to know why they don’t explore non-embedded track — the track is embedded all the way down the ramp and only transitions to non-embedded inside the tunnel. If it were non-embedded from somewhere short of the ramp, it would make it significantly harder to enter the tunnel with a regular vehicle. There could even be a trap on the ramp where the floor falls away and the rails are supported on steel beams for a distance of a few metres, so that the only possible way for a vehicle to enter the tunnel would be to balance on the rails themselves. Doesn’t really solve the problem but makes clearing stuck cars much much faster and possibly able to be done by a regular tow truck.
I would also want to know how people get misdirected. Do they turn into the wrong right-of-way at the previous intersection (York St.) or do they mount the curb from Queens Quay into the streetcar right-of-way? The latter could be eliminated with a line of regular, non-moving bollards.
Finally, somebody please tell me that the TTC has a lien on the vehicle against their costs. It would be insane if somebody could drive their vehicle in there, force the TTC to incur thousands of dollars in costs, and then just get their vehicle back with nothing but a few dents and a fine. They should have a non-dischargeable-in-bankruptcy debt owed to the TTC secured by their vehicle for the full amount of the TTC’s costs.
Thousands of dollars. Ha! I'm betting it costs TTC an order of magnitude more, maybe even more than that. And if you look at the social cost due to delays, I wouldn't be shocked if it was pushing into seven figure territory.
RE: Toronto transit projects - Canard - 03-18-2018
(03-18-2018, 12:20 PM)ijmorlan Wrote: Retractable bollards do seem like a good idea. I would like to know why they don’t explore non-embedded track — the track is embedded all the way down the ramp and only transitions to non-embedded inside the tunnel. If it were non-embedded from somewhere short of the ramp, it would make it significantly harder to enter the tunnel with a regular vehicle. There could even be a trap on the ramp where the floor falls away and the rails are supported on steel beams for a distance of a few metres, so that the only possible way for a vehicle to enter the tunnel would be to balance on the rails themselves. Doesn’t really solve the problem but makes clearing stuck cars much much faster and possibly able to be done by a regular tow truck.
I suggested this to Brad Ross but he said that then they still have the problem of a vehicle extraction.
They are installing electric automatic gates.
I cycled past today and took a good look again at the setup, it's unbelievable that anyone could go down there. The driver of the latest infraction was apparently drunk, so it's actually probably better he shot down there and got stuck, instead of of mowing people down on the harbourfront...
RE: Toronto transit projects - KevinL - 03-21-2018
A streetcar documentary, filmed in Toronto and at the Halton museum, in IMAX? Sign me up.
Not sure the plugin is working - link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-tJh_VNlbQ
RE: Toronto transit projects - Canard - 03-21-2018
Wonderful!
I remember as a little kid being at a friend's house. His Aunt from Toronto was over. I asked her "Do you ride on the trolley?" and she had no idea what I was talking about. She eventually realized I was talking about streetcars.
Looks like it was done by the same folks who did Rocky Mountain Express (Also IMAX).
Quote:The Trolley will have its World Premiere at the Hot Docs Canadian International Documentary Festival on Saturday, May 5 at the Cinesphere, Ontario Place at 3PM EST.