07-08-2023, 04:52 PM
(07-08-2023, 11:12 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: I mean, that's a perception...but it's only a result of a strongly conservative council...which has now changed.
I also think the subways are different...they might be less optimal (although I find the objections to the Ontario line pretty weak) but they aren't an wildly destructive as the Gardiner project. And the Gardiner project is also not as far along as the others I believe.
They’re not as bad as rebuilding the Gardiner, but both projects I mentioned are pretty bad.
In Scarborough, they are spending the same money that could build an entire network of high-quality LRT with dozens of stations on a subway expansion that only adds a couple of new stations and eliminates most of the existing RT stations; I believe they will end up with fewer mass transit stations than there are now.
The Ontario line will be a different technology from the subway network thanks to Doug Ford and the route was laid down by Doug Ford, not by designers and engineers who actually know what they are doing. The alternative is another subway line using identical technology to the existing lines. The different technology is to save money in tunnelling (narrower tunnels), which is nice, but there is a cost in having a multiplicity of technologies, and their Scarborough and Eglinton West plans prove they don’t actually care about saving money (which reminds me of your observations about what true fiscal conservatism might look like — not penny-pinching on transit and building roads all over the place, that much is sure). And if I remember correctly the route changes are to allow more “savings” by bridging rather than tunneling the Don River, ignoring the fact that transitioning back and forth between above and below ground imposes its own costs.
Quote:FWIW...I do think there is a risk in cancelling in progress projects (Toronto has made this mistake many times) but the Gardiner is one that I think could be cancelled at this point.
Yes, the Gardiner really isn’t very far along. So maybe there is some hope! I would say that while I am almost certain the subway projects I named are bad projects, compared to the alternatives which were cancelled, I’m not absolutely confident that cancelling them is the correct choice. By contrast, I feel quite confident agreeing that the Gardiner should be cancelled (both the existing project and the road segment).