General Politics Discussion

[tomh009]

Chapman winning would remove her from local politics, though, and just make her an NDP back-bencher ...

[ac3r]

You either become cynical or someone like Debbie.

[ac3r]

There’s nothing more NDP to me than rolling out the “everyone’s welcome here!” sign on their front yard and yet working their hardest to support NIMBYs at every opportunity.

I might be becoming too cynical for my own good 😵

You either become cynical or become someone like Debbie.

Chapman winning would remove her from local politics, though, and just make her an NDP back-bencher ...

Hard to imagine what's worse, though: Chapman holding influence over local government or over provincial government? It's a lose/lose situation.

[Bytor]

There’s nothing more NDP to me than rolling out the “everyone’s welcome here!” sign on their front yard and yet working their hardest to support NIMBYs at every opportunity.

I might be becoming too cynical for my own good 😵

You either become cynical or become someone like Debbie.

Chapman winning would remove her from local politics, though, and just make her an NDP back-bencher ...

Hard to imagine what's worse, though: Chapman holding influence over local government or over provincial government? It's a lose/lose situation.

I initotally thought the same thing, but then somebody reminded me that as a backbencher she wouldn't have much influence over party policy.

[ZEBuilder]

Chapman winning would remove her from local politics, though, and just make her an NDP back-bencher ...

Hard to imagine what's worse, though: Chapman holding influence over local government or over provincial government? It's a lose/lose situation.

Well even if she does win the seat she'd still be effectively powerless, the Ford government will still have a majority government so it's not like it would change what is currently happening with regards to the provincial policy, Ford will still push for the Bradford Bypass and the 413, make his developer buddies rich and everything he has done over the last year. As much as I hate Chapman I'd much rather her in the provincial government where she can't really do anything than have to deal with her comments at the local level. Hopefully if she does win it would mean a more progressive leader for Ward 9 which is something that is definitely needed.

[KevinL]

 Hopefully if she does win it would mean a more progressive leader for Ward 9 which is something that is definitely needed.

Is that the same ward Brooklin ran in last election? If so I imagine she has a decent chance.

[ZEBuilder]

 Hopefully if she does win it would mean a more progressive leader for Ward 9 which is something that is definitely needed.

Is that the same ward Brooklin ran in last election? If so I imagine she has a decent chance.

Yes Ward 9 had Debbie Chapman, Brooklin Wallis, David Redman, Beth Warren and Alex Shevchenko as those running for office.

[cherrypark]

 Hopefully if she does win it would mean a more progressive leader for Ward 9 which is something that is definitely needed.

Is that the same ward Brooklin ran in last election? If so I imagine she has a decent chance.

Yes the NDP nomination was a re-match of Debbie and Brooklin. Honestly a little surprised they were the only ones to put their hands up and figure the most progressive supporters of the ONDP are going to have more inclination to shop their vote with her as the candidate.

[danbrotherston]

Is that the same ward Brooklin ran in last election? If so I imagine she has a decent chance.

Yes the NDP nomination was a re-match of Debbie and Brooklin. Honestly a little surprised they were the only ones to put their hands up and figure the most progressive supporters of the ONDP are going to have more inclination to shop their vote with her as the candidate.

Unfortunately Debbie won.

To be honest, I don't know much about the NDP...this result kinda leads me to believe that they're fake progressives like the liberals. I want them to be better, but this result doesn't give me confidence.

The problem is it is a primary...anyone I would express this too, would be the very group of people who democratically chose to support Debbie.

Either way, I'll not be voting NDP this election...

[Joedelay Highhoe]

If Debbie does win the MPP seat, at least she'll be able to perform as her best self: vote "no," enjoy the perks of a powerful position, and do literally nothing else.

[taylortbb]

To be honest, I don't know much about the NDP...this result kinda leads me to believe that they're fake progressives like the liberals. I want them to be better, but this result doesn't give me confidence.

The NDP has always had a pretty strong populist streak, I think it comes from their roots in organized labour.

I felt the same way about the Ontario NDP promising to eliminate HST on home heating bills. It's populist and I get why they do it, but given climate change we should be using price to moderate consumption. Rebates for those that are lower income is better policy, but that wouldn't help the middle class (who's the actual electoral target).

[ac3r]

Hard to imagine what's worse, though: Chapman holding influence over local government or over provincial government? It's a lose/lose situation.

Well even if she does win the seat she'd still be effectively powerless, the Ford government will still have a majority government so it's not like it would change what is currently happening with regards to the provincial policy, Ford will still push for the Bradford Bypass and the 413, make his developer buddies rich and everything he has done over the last year. As much as I hate Chapman I'd much rather her in the provincial government where she can't really do anything than have to deal with her comments at the local level. Hopefully if she does win it would mean a more progressive leader for Ward 9 which is something that is definitely needed.

I worry this is shortsighted, though. Let's say the NDP somehow got into power next week - or she became Premier, somehow. Now imagine the sort of nonsense policies she would push for if at the local level she hates everything and everyone besides what she and her selfish husband own and control.

To me it doesn't matter if she's sitting on the backbench or making all the decisions because she has a toxic, regressive, shortsighted, racist + classist, anti-progressive ideology she wants to see through. I mean Donald Trump used to be both centrist and Democrat until becoming a useful idiot for the post-fascist movement and now he's being indicted for stealing nuclear documents and war plans against Iran.

People are governed by beliefs - theological, ideological, philosophical - and you have to analyze that. Even if she hasn't come out and said "yeah I love Ayn Rand and David Hume" it's easy enough to tell she's a very conservative person who is abusing the power of being in office - and abusing parties/ideologies (namely, those which lean left) in order to further her own conservative agenda. She is the antithesis of what the New Democratic Party is supposed to stand for and if she somehow runs for them...wow. I guess I'll all in on the Rhinoceros Party or something.

I don't know. I guess this really pisses me off especially because I am an egoist anarchist but vote NDP as they're the lesser of all evils to choose from. It's why I despise politics...it never serves the majority of people any good, but if I have to choose who fucks us the hardest I'll go with the more gentle one - the NDP in this case. But Champan needs to retire. This old hag no business in politics.

[panamaniac]

Kitchener, Cambridge, and Waterloo among the cities granted "strong mayor" powers, effective 01 July.

[nms]

I think it will be interesting to see what happens when the "strong mayors" decide to do things that the PC government wasn't anticipating (eg anything left of centre that Doug Ford railed against while he was on Toronto City Council).

[danbrotherston]

I think it will be interesting to see what happens when the "strong mayors" decide to do things that the PC government wasn't anticipating (eg anything left of centre that Doug Ford railed against while he was on Toronto City Council).

I am betting that this won't happen.

Mostly because I'm cynical...

The left is rarely bold, often afraid of it's own shadow.

Yeah, some progressive mayors might do things DoFo disagrees with, but they'll still not do anything radical and ambitious. Where as right wing extremist conservatives given strong mayor powers absolutely would start doing extreme things.

Of course, some of this isn't on progressives themselves. Our largely conservative media would eviscerate any progressive policies, while strongly normalising even the most extreme regressive policies.

</cynical>