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2015 Federal Election
#16
I didn't have to stand in line yesterday. It took me two minutes to get signed in, vote and leave.
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#17
I did have to stand in line behind about three people. It took about a ten minute wait for those three people to be processed. I'm not complaining about a ten minute wait, but the two women behind me were. There were two clerks at the desk, and they had to wait for the previous voter to actually return with the ballot and deposit it to start registering the next voter. As with all line ups, it can be delayed if someone put his ID back in his wallet, or actually takes his voting decision while he has the ballot.

Maybe it is higher turnout, which would be a good thing. I vote in advanced polls as a matter of course, and have in the past voted without seeing another voter in the station.
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#18
(10-11-2015, 05:35 AM)MidTowner Wrote: I did have to stand in line behind about three people. It took about a ten minute wait for those three people to be processed. I'm not complaining about a ten minute wait, but the two women behind me were. There were two clerks at the desk, and they had to wait for the previous voter to actually return with the ballot and deposit it to start registering the next voter. As with all line ups, it can be delayed if someone put his ID back in his wallet, or actually takes his voting decision while he has the ballot.

Maybe it is higher turnout, which would be a good thing. I vote in advanced polls as a matter of course, and have in the past voted without seeing another voter in the station.

I can’t remember for sure, but that sounds strange to me. My recollection, faulty though it may be, is that one voter takes their ballot and goes to the privacy box, and they immediately start checking in the next voter. I live right across the street from my election day polling place so I’ll be voting there. I’ll make a point of observing how they handle that. I can’t see why advance polls would be run differently from election day polls but maybe there is a reason.
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#19
One way in which advanced polling differs from the process on the day of the election is that they transcribe your name and address onto a separate list, and you are asked to sign next to the information.

It seemed odd to me, too, that they waited until a voter returned from the box to process the next voter. It was strange for others ahead of me, too, who assumed that they would show their ID while the previous voter was voting, but were asked to wait.
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#20
(10-11-2015, 08:25 AM)MidTowner Wrote: One way in which advanced polling differs from the process on the day of the election is that they transcribe your name and address onto a separate list, and you are asked to sign next to the information.
That's what the media reported and what I suggested could be computerized, not the actual balloting itself that others have criticized above.

Presumably the list from which voters' names and addresses are transcribed is in some computer database already. So it's already subject to security breaches, hackers, etc. All I was suggesting is that rather than transcribe that stuff manually, which incidentally opens it up to all sorts of transcription errors, it would be a lot simpler (and faster!) to print that stuff off the database onto a registration form, then ask each voter to sign their form.

Quote:It seemed odd to me, too, that they waited until a voter returned from the box to process the next voter. It was strange for others ahead of me, too, who assumed that they would show their ID while the previous voter was voting, but were asked to wait.
This could also be due to a lack of proper education of the polling station staff.

P.S. I never understood the point of collecting all those entry cards we have to fill in on flights that enter Canada. There must be 10s of millions of them every year. Once you've been allowed to enter Canada what's the point of keeping them? Does someone in Ottawa actually read them?  Huh  Confused  At least now you have the option of scanning them with some basic OCR validation and data collection. If that became universal it might actually provide some useful statistical data.
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#21
(10-11-2015, 10:08 AM)ookpik Wrote:
(10-11-2015, 08:25 AM)MidTowner Wrote: One way in which advanced polling differs from the process on the day of the election is that they transcribe your name and address onto a separate list, and you are asked to sign next to the information.
That's what the media reported and what I suggested could be computerized, not the actual balloting itself that others have criticized above.

Indeed. This could at the very least be a duplicate of the original list with a signature field.

Quote:Presumably the list from which voters' names and addresses are transcribed is in some computer database already.

This is the list of registered voters stored by Elections Canada. It is compiled from many sources, the primary one being the information taken down on your T1 General by the Canada Revenue Agency every spring (if you tick the box that says "please share my name and address with Elections Canada").

Quote:P.S. I never understood the point of collecting all those entry cards we have to fill in on flights that enter Canada. There must be 10s of millions of them every year. Once you've been allowed to enter Canada what's the point of keeping them? Does someone in Ottawa actually read them?  Huh  Confused  At least now you have the option of scanning them with some basic OCR validation and data collection. If that became universal it might actually provide some useful statistical data.

This helps figure out a lot of things: number of people entering Canada, by what means, for how long, for what purpose, bringing what declarable items. To say nothing of how it's a useful visual token for the Border Security and Customs and Immigration folks (like a bording pass is for airline and security staff).

This information can be used in a lot of useful ways from determining which entry points are most used and are, thus, in most need of funding; to what areas of the country will be more likely to receive tourism funding to develop or protect the area; to what goods people are purchasing abroad showing trade deficiencies.
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#22
(10-11-2015, 11:08 AM)chutten Wrote: This is the list of registered voters stored by Elections Canada. It is compiled from many sources, the primary one being the information taken down on your T1 General by the Canada Revenue Agency every spring (if you tick the box that says "please share my name and address with Elections Canada").
So if we rely on the accuracy of this computerized list in general, why can't we also rely on it at advance polls? Presumably the ID check (name, address, photo, etc.) already acts as a double-check against errors on the source list.

Quote:This helps figure out a lot of things: number of people entering Canada, by what means, for how long, for what purpose, bringing what declarable items. To say nothing of how it's a useful visual token for the Border Security and Customs and Immigration folks (like a bording pass is for airline and security staff).

This information can be used in a lot of useful ways from determining which entry points are most used and are, thus, in most need of funding; to what areas of the country will be more likely to receive tourism funding to develop or protect the area; to what goods people are purchasing abroad showing trade deficiencies.
I'm not questioning the utility of this information. My point is that the cards are collected after people have cleared CBSA and are free to enter Canada. Once they've left the border entry point it's too late to go after them if discrepancies turn up in the form.

Since the cards are filled in by hand (sometimes a shaky hand writing on a wobbly tray table on a turbulent flight) it must be difficult to collect this information by any automated means. Are there "masses of asses" in Ottawa who go through millions of these forms every year transcribing data into some database?

As for "what goods people are purchasing abroad" since the cards now only ask for total dollar amounts, how would such information be collected? (The cards used to distinguish between alcohol, tobacco and all other goods but they haven't done that for many years now.)

Apologies for digressing from federal election registration forms. I was simply trying to point out yet another instance where some computerization would not only be more efficient but might also generate more useful information and/or better validate the information that's already in the system.
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#23
(10-11-2015, 12:02 PM)ookpik Wrote: Apologies for digressing from federal election registration forms. I was simply trying to point out yet another instance where some computerization would not only be more efficient but might also generate more useful information and/or better validate the information that's already in the system.

Nearly twenty years ago Paul Krugman, the famous economist, brought up the possibility that computerization in society was nearly complete. Every time I see someone reentering already available electronic information by hand I know we are far from having reached the "all tasks complete" hypothesis of PK.

Going to vote now.
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#24
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#25
(10-11-2015, 05:35 AM)MidTowner Wrote: There were two clerks at the desk, and they had to wait for the previous voter to actually return with the ballot and deposit it to start registering the next voter.

The station I went to didn't operate that way. They processed new people while the previous one voted. The line moved fast.
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#26
(10-11-2015, 10:08 AM)ookpik Wrote: P.S. I never understood the point of collecting all those entry cards we have to fill in on flights that enter Canada. There must be 10s of millions of them every year. Once you've been allowed to enter Canada what's the point of keeping them? Does someone in Ottawa actually read them?  Huh  Confused  At least now you have the option of scanning them with some basic OCR validation and data collection. If that became universal it might actually provide some useful statistical data.

I can assure you that these cards are used after the fact.  Stats for local office are collected from them, then they are sent to Stats Can who takes the data from them.  

As well, as a legal signed document, they are used as physical evidence in cases of smuggling/criminal activity by the officer performing enforcement action.

Coke
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#27
(10-11-2015, 02:07 PM)Osiris Wrote:

Thank you, I think that was the most helpful explanation against electronic voting, and I see what you're getting at now.
For daily ion construction updates, photos and general urban rail news, follow me on twitter! @Canardiain
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#28
I don't understand how so many people think online voting is a great idea.  That's literally the worst idea I've ever heard of.  It combines all the issues of e-voting machines and adds vote buying and intimidation to the mix not to mention that suddenly a spouse may find his/her vote made on their behalf against their will.

Edit: Yeah, no one was talking about it in this thread... I'm just venting.  Sad
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#29
Hmm, I'm not sure I see how it's "the worst idea". I see online voting resulting in more people voting, because it would be more convenient. There would be no excuse not to vote.
For daily ion construction updates, photos and general urban rail news, follow me on twitter! @Canardiain
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#30
A thought occurred to me: if candidates aren't allowed to campaign on election day, why are they allowed to campaign after advance polls open?
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