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Victoria Park Tent City
#16
(06-26-2015, 07:27 AM)BuildingScout Wrote: Subsidized housing also known as projects, which trap people in a bad environment.

That is one way of doing it, massive complexes that are only subsidized housing. It is not a good way.

(06-26-2015, 08:59 AM)tomh009 Wrote: Another option is to encourage (again, maybe through subsidies) new construction to include, say, 10% of apartment units to be "affordable", however that's defined.

This is much more reasonable, and is the kind of approach I would support.
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#17
At the extreme end, I see that the last of the "Out of the Cold" churches is shutting down its shelter, which suggests that the Region has its act together in terms of sheltering the homeless.

As for social housing, it seems to me that there is great potential to incorporate subsidized housing into projects on lands held by a number of Downtown churches. It has been done in many other cities and I believe that the concept for redeveloping the Trinity Church lands includes something along this line.
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#18
(06-26-2015, 08:59 AM)tomh009 Wrote: Regarding mpd618's point about the neighbourhood conflicts, yes, this can happen.  But I really do believe that many low-income people do want to live in a "nice" or "clean" home, as long as they can afford it.  We just need to make those kinds of homes available, by focusing the construction costs on the essentials and not on fripperies.  And making appropriate-size units, of course.

Yes. I found that Options for Homes was good at constructing such places, which used to be much more inexpensive than other new condos. I used to live in one of those units on Brighton St. The asking price for these units on the resale market has gone curiously high. I wonder about that. (I think they're overpriced for what they are.)

(06-26-2015, 10:56 AM)panamaniac Wrote: At the extreme end, I see that the last of the "Out of the Cold" churches is shutting down its shelter, which suggests that the Region has its act together in terms of sheltering the homeless.

I thought I'd seen coverage about how the Out of the Cold churches were shutting down overnight sheltering because they didn't have the capacity to deal with the clientele they were getting, not because there was adequate capacity.
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#19
(06-26-2015, 11:04 AM)plam Wrote:
(06-26-2015, 08:59 AM)tomh009 Wrote: Regarding mpd618's point about the neighbourhood conflicts, yes, this can happen.  But I really do believe that many low-income people do want to live in a "nice" or "clean" home, as long as they can afford it.  We just need to make those kinds of homes available, by focusing the construction costs on the essentials and not on fripperies.  And making appropriate-size units, of course.

Yes. I found that Options for Homes was good at constructing such places, which used to be much more inexpensive than other new condos. I used to live in one of those units on Brighton St. The asking price for these units on the resale market has gone curiously high. I wonder about that. (I think they're overpriced for what they are.)


(06-26-2015, 10:56 AM)panamaniac Wrote: At the extreme end, I see that the last of the "Out of the Cold" churches is shutting down its shelter, which suggests that the Region has its act together in terms of sheltering the homeless.

I thought I'd seen coverage about how the Out of the Cold churches were shutting down overnight sheltering because they didn't have the capacity to deal with the clientele they were getting, not because there was adequate capacity.

I believe that was true for some of them, but after alternate arrangements were put in place with the first closings, the other churches seemed to find that there was no longer enough demand to justify continuing their programs.  At least that is what I understand.  I guess this winter will show whether the Region has adequate programs in place in the absence of "Out of the Cold".
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#20
On the affordable housing point, does it make sense for the city to require developments to have a certain percentage of units geared towards low income individuals? Maybe sell them to Kitchener Housing at a subsidised cost?
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#21
One of the new condo developments on the waterfront is doing it; ten units are going to be subsidized. I hope the region can do something similar - preferably without the 'poor door' such developments are installing so the penthouse dwellers don't have to risk coming into contact with subsidized residents.
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#22
(06-27-2015, 10:53 AM)Spokes Wrote: On the affordable housing point, does it make sense for the city to require developments to have a certain percentage of units geared towards low income individuals?  Maybe sell them to Kitchener Housing at a subsidised cost?

I would prefer it to be optional (not compulsory), but with a sufficient incentive that most condo projects would take it on.  Maybe two levels, 10% and 20%?

(06-27-2015, 11:46 AM)DHLawrence Wrote: One of the new condo developments on the waterfront is doing it; ten units are going to be subsidized. I hope the region can do something similar - preferably without the 'poor door' such developments are installing so the penthouse dwellers don't have to risk coming into contact with subsidized residents.

Even in a normal condo building you may have a range of prices from $300K to $900K.  Adding in some lower-cost units at around $200K doesn't radically change that scenario.

Now, in a condo building someone will need to buy those low-cost units, and hopefully most of them would end up on the rental market.
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#23
Who said they were going to be 200k? I'm talking about Ten York, where some units are going to be managed by Toronto Community Housing. Last time I checked they weren't in the market rent business.
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#24
(06-27-2015, 05:09 PM)DHLawrence Wrote: Who said they were going to be 200k? I'm talking about Ten York, where some units are going to be managed by Toronto Community Housing. Last time I checked they weren't in the market rent business.

Nobody said anything about prices, but every unit will have a cost, none are free to build.  I threw a number out there to show that the differences are still the same order of magnitude.  Sorry if that upset you.
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#25
(06-27-2015, 11:46 AM)DHLawrence Wrote: One of the new condo developments on the waterfront is doing it; ten units are going to be subsidized. I hope the region can do something similar - preferably without the 'poor door' such developments are installing so the penthouse dwellers don't have to risk coming into contact with subsidized residents.

I'm against builder subsidies. Instead we should require that certain number of units be very small, e.g. two bedroom 400sq ft. These would be less desirable units likely go for a lower price and ensure a healthy mix of lower and upper end units. This is at nearly no cost to the developer since price for two 400sq ft units is likely to be comparable the price of one 800sq. ft. unit (be it rent or purchase).
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#26
(06-27-2015, 06:58 PM)BuildingScout Wrote:
(06-27-2015, 11:46 AM)DHLawrence Wrote: One of the new condo developments on the waterfront is doing it; ten units are going to be subsidized. I hope the region can do something similar - preferably without the 'poor door' such developments are installing so the penthouse dwellers don't have to risk coming into contact with subsidized residents.

I'm against builder subsidies. Instead we should require that certain number of units be very small, e.g. two bedroom 400sq ft. These would be less desirable units likely go for a lower price and ensure a healthy mix of lower and upper end units. This is at nearly no cost to the developer since price for two 400sq ft units is likely to be comparable the price of one 800sq. ft. unit (be it rent or purchase).

The challenge is defining such things so that you get a desirable outcome.  What we really want are some units that are affordable: that might be the result of some combination of size, finishes, features (balcony? appliances?), floor, view etc.  I don't know how to write non-subjective rules for that, though.
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#27
Before the Mayfair Hotel was acquired by the City, it had been home to many low-income residents. The same was the case for the Station Hotel at Weber and Victoria before it burned down.

Cities have long been home to transient populations, often those just entering the workforce who have moved away from their home community, who require short-term accommodations. Working men and women moving to the big city to live in a rooming house with a landlady who depending on the circumstances, would also provide meals. Sometimes, companies who needed workers would supply their own boarding houses. Organizations such as the YMCA did the same thing (ever wonder why the song goes, "It's fun to stay at the YMCA"?)
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#28
(06-29-2015, 02:13 PM)nms Wrote: Cities have long been home to transient populations, often those just entering the workforce who have moved away from their home community, who require short-term accommodations. Working men and women moving to the big city to live in a rooming house with a landlady who depending on the circumstances, would also provide meals. Sometimes, companies who needed workers would supply their own boarding houses. Organizations such as the YMCA did the same thing (ever wonder why the song goes, "It's fun to stay at the YMCA"?)

I wonder whether many people still would like to live in a rooming house.  Company-provided rooming houses do still exist, just not in North America (apart from some remote locations where no other housing is available).
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#29
(06-29-2015, 03:24 PM)tomh009 Wrote:
(06-29-2015, 02:13 PM)nms Wrote: Cities have long been home to transient populations, often those just entering the workforce who have moved away from their home community, who require short-term accommodations. Working men and women moving to the big city to live in a rooming house with a landlady who depending on the circumstances, would also provide meals. Sometimes, companies who needed workers would supply their own boarding houses. Organizations such as the YMCA did the same thing (ever wonder why the song goes, "It's fun to stay at the YMCA"?)

I wonder whether many people still would like to live in a rooming house.  Company-provided rooming houses do still exist, just not in North America (apart from some remote locations where no other housing is available).

I bet people would like them in Silicon Valley. But there are other issues there.
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#30
Some places offer furnished apartment rentals by the week but the cost is usually obscene.
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