General Road and Highway Discussion

[KevinL]

Sorry, I meant the Manitou bridge (just north of the end of Bleams).

And yes, the bridge is brand new as part of the widening and reconstruction of Manitou over the last couple years.

[GtwoK]

You are correct Canard, they'll be building a bridge over the ravine at the end of Bleams as a part of the River Road expansion (whenever that ends up stops being delayed...)

[Canard]

I had recalled that there were talks of doing this; so I was surprised to hear it was going ahead, hence my questioning the location!

I've unfortunately now twice this weekend driven over this bridge and forgotten on both occasions to try and take a look at the unique architecture of it.

[KevinL]

The new Manitou bridge is nearly complete - an impressive parapet with SCHNEIDER CREEK boldly embossed. The railings are not fully in, so the temporary orange fencing detracts from the visual impact a bit.

This is now pretty much complete. The railings are finished, with a lovely wavelike pattern as a background; stone finishings have also been mortared onto the parapets. One of the best projects of this sort I've seen in some time!

Wish I had pictures, but only saw it from a moving bus...

[Markster]

Proposal:

The highway 8 onramp from King St at the 85. (Google Maps)

Does anyone else think that it's ridiculous that King St gets 2 full lanes that continue on to the expressway, while all the traffic from 85 Eastbound only get a single lane, and are forced to merge?

Existing:  (ugh.... I just realized my directions are all screwed up... I'm not fixing it right now, please forgive)
   
2 lanes from 85 westbound
2 lanes from King St
1 lane from 85 eastbound that has to merge

Whenever the pulse of traffic arrives from King St, there's a lot of contention.  The stream of traffic from 85 eastbound has to back up and slow down because of finding space between cars from King St.  Lots of people are making fast merges.

Proposed:
   
2 lanes from 85 westbound
1 lane from King St (with space so that there is room to merge after accelerating from the stop light)
1 lane from 85 eastbound that continues

This way there isn't that continuous stream of traffic that is merging constantly into the rightmost lane.  They just get a lane, and continue.  The King St cars have to merge, but there's a lot of acceleration space, and can filter down to one lane in that time.

[gomesjustin]

I'm wondering if it's the size of the ramp coming of of 7/8 (Conestoga Parkway) onto 8. Or the sheer lack of size of the turning radius? That could be causing this back-up? Or maybe there should be two lanes coming off of 7/8 onto 8? Close one lane on the King St. entrance and make the exit two lanes from 7/8 (Conestoga Pkwy.) onto 8

I have a hard time thinking that there is that much traffic coming onto the Hwy 8 from King Street to justify closing the right lane.

[danbrotherston]

...

This seems to make sense in theory, I kinda assume the 85 eastbound -> 8 South carries more traffic than the King St. merge, but I don't know for sure.

But there are some possible caveats, King St. traffic is accelerating from a traffic light, that might make the merge a bit more problematic.  But I think the distance, plus the limited traffic means it should be no problem.

I suspect it's probably a better design...I wonder if/why it was/wasn't considered, and why it isn't used.

[timio]

There is seemingly no reason why King should be four lanes for that small stretch. I'd there that much traffic coming from Charles (especially in the near future with Charles down to one lane) that requires it to remain two lanes each direction? That could free up some space.

[tomh009]

Note that it's the same arrangement going westbound, too: two lanes existing to 85 EB, one lane to 85 WB, and one/two lanes to King Street.

I suspect this arrangement dates back to the 1960s when the Expressway was first built; probably the two-lane King Street was seen as a "grand entrance" to the city. Yes, the wide centre boulevard plus four lanes take up a lot of space. However, I don't see any particularly good use for that space in the near term, the real estate demand is really not very high in this area. 20-30 years from now, sure, it would probably make sense to reconfigure.

[curiouschair]

Proposal:

The highway 8 onramp from King St at the 85. (Google Maps)

[...]

It's a short merge from 7/8 to 8 as well, I think this would greatly improve things, without really affecting King St drivers too negatively.

I wonder how soon in the future (if at all) this 7/8 to/from 8 will be 2 lanes in each direction, similar to the other direction? Probably something complex would have to be built?

Also I think technically it's not 85 there, I think that starts after Victoria st? I'm not completely sure, it's pretty confusing with all the changes in compass directions and several numbers in the area.

[mpd618]

I think the Hwy 85/8 proposal makes a ton of sense.

There's another spot where a similar idea might help: the off-ramp from Hwy 8 to eastbound King St E. Just prior to the ramp, King St goes from one to two lanes, and the ramp has little merge space with poor visibility. So the idea would be for King St to stay at one lane and the off-ramp to join it as the second lane.

(One argument against this would be that if drivers flying down the off-ramp don't have to merge, they'd go too fast on King St.)

[Canard]

The whole interface of Highway 8 to King St. is awful. I absolutely hate "the race" that everyone does and then improperly merges by Rockway when it goes from 2 to 1 lane. It's so pointless to have 2 lanes on King for that one little stretch.

[timio]

The 85/8 referred to is actually the interchange of the Conestoga Parkway and 8/King.

The 8/King street exit referred to is at the King Street exit just south of the river heading towards Cambridge.

[tomh009]

The whole interface of Highway 8 to King St. is awful. I absolutely hate "the race" that everyone does and then improperly merges by Rockway when it goes from 2 to 1 lane. It's so pointless to have 2 lanes on King for that one little stretch.

I don't find the racing there to be that bad or frequent.  Certainly far less than any similar spot in Toronto ...

I'm sure this will be reconfigured sometime in the future, but it's probably far down the priority list.  As it should be, I think: many other issues should be addressed first.

[Canard]

I used to drive it every day. Waiting at the red light, I'd watch people in my rear view mirror, flying up behind me... Jockeying to get in the left (I think) lane - the one that ends. Knowing full well it ends... But didn't want to queue up like everyone else, then floor it and slam in at the last possible moment with no signal.

I get that in a perfect world, every-other car coming off the highway would go left/left/right and fill both lanes, so it moves as efficiently through the light, and then zipper-merge on the far side - but that never happens because people drive like dicks.

I always wanted to roll down my window and just say "...you realize that lane ends in like 200 m, right?"