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Mall Retail (Cambridge Centre, Conestoga, Fairview)
(02-11-2018, 10:14 AM)tomh009 Wrote: Which city? Kitchener does have enclosed walkways from Market Square to both the old city hall and to Crown Plaza. That's not many, but greater than zero.

The Region of Waterloo. I am aware of the Kitchener links. Speaking of Kitchener, I think the whole institutional precinct from Market Square through the courthouse and over to regional headquarters and Centre in the Square is the sort of area where I would like to see indoor connections between buildings, and new buildings designed to connect to nearby buildings. It’s an area where all the buildings are large public buildings and there are lots of people. As a result, many would benefit from the links and it’s feasible for the various buildings to negotiate appropriate links. Also the cost of the links is relatively small compared to overall construction costs.

And of course installing links like this makes public transit more attractive if the walk between transit and the destination may be taken partially or entirely indoors.

But I’m not just talking about big bridges which I recognize are expensive, and depending on how and where they are constructed may have questionable aesthetics or other problems. There are many missed opportunities for smaller scale protection. I’m thinking of a strip mall with a roof in front of some of the stores. But it ends arbitrarily at a corner, and then the entrance to the office building at the end of the mall has its entrance over some distance, not connected to the roof.

Or the University, where building projects in that last couple of years provided the opportunity, not taken, to put bus waiting areas indoors, with windows allowing to see the bus coming and a roof covering most of the distance to the actual point where the bus stops.

Or the new building at Waterloo Town Square, where there is a canopy over some entrance doors but not others. It makes me think that the designer thinks of the canopy strictly as a visual architectural feature and not as a practical operational feature of the building.

And by protected walkways, I don’t just mean fully-enclosed climate-controlled walkways; I mean any sort of protection, even down to just a roof over a path to catch precipitation but not affect cold temperature or wind. St. Jerome’s has some of these; but in building their new building they inexplicably cut an existing one short so that it doesn’t reach the new building. This proves it’s not about cost; they paid extra to remove an existing roof!
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(02-11-2018, 02:24 AM)ijmorlan Wrote:  The LRT stops will almost provide the link from the shelter into the vehicle but as far as I know none of them are linked to any destinations, including bus platforms, with the exception of the stop on Caroline which has a cross-platform transfer to bus.


Fairway stop has covered access to the Ion bus for travel towards Cambridge.
My Twitter: @KevinLMaps
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I would say that the Theatre probably does not want a connection to the mall, because it would likely go straight to the food court, which would siphon off even more concession sales (high margin) than their current proximity does.
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(02-11-2018, 10:49 AM)ijmorlan Wrote: And by protected walkways, I don’t just mean fully-enclosed climate-controlled walkways; I mean any sort of protection, even down to just a roof over a path to catch precipitation but not affect cold temperature or wind. St. Jerome’s has some of these; but in building their new building they inexplicably cut an existing one short so that it doesn’t reach the new building. This proves it’s not about cost; they paid extra to remove an existing roof!

So, if it isn't the cost, then what is it? I'm sure it's not as inexplicable as one might think.

I'm only speculating, but maybe it has to do with something in the building code. Like this from section 3.2.3.19: "Except as required by Sentence 3.2.3.20.(2), if buildings are connected by a walkway, each building shall be separated from the walkway by a fire separation with a fire-resistance rating not less than 45 min."

But I am not an architect, engineer, building inspector, or hardware specialist of any kind, so maybe that isn't it.
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The fire code and/or other building codes will often be a problem. For the mall to movie theatre connection, there may also be the issue that the fire department would want to be able to get all the way around the building in the event of an emergency. On a related note, when I took a look at Conestoga Mall in air photos, there is a very impressive solar array on top of the Zehrs.

I expect that with respect to the University of Waterloo, an internal bus waiting area will evolve when the new transit terminal is developed on the east end of campus.
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An interesting meditation on the fate of the downtown mall in Ontario: https://seanmarshall.ca/2018/02/14/ontar...own-malls/
My Twitter: @KevinLMaps
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About 7 or 8 years ago, I dropped by wife (then girlfriend) off in the Bayside Mall in Sarnia while I went to a dentist appointment elsewhere in town. She had been drawn in by the allure of a store known as Pantorama. When I returned to pick her up, she told me it was the most depressing place she had ever been and to top it off, Pantorama was no more.
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(02-12-2018, 12:10 PM)timc Wrote:
(02-11-2018, 10:49 AM)ijmorlan Wrote: And by protected walkways, I don’t just mean fully-enclosed climate-controlled walkways; I mean any sort of protection, even down to just a roof over a path to catch precipitation but not affect cold temperature or wind. St. Jerome’s has some of these; but in building their new building they inexplicably cut an existing one short so that it doesn’t reach the new building. This proves it’s not about cost; they paid extra to remove an existing roof!

So, if it isn't the cost, then what is it? I'm sure it's not as inexplicable as one might think.

I'm only speculating, but maybe it has to do with something in the building code. Like this from section 3.2.3.19: "Except as required by Sentence 3.2.3.20.(2), if buildings are connected by a walkway, each building shall be separated from the walkway by a fire separation with a fire-resistance rating not less than 45 min."

But I am not an architect, engineer, building inspector, or hardware specialist of any kind, so maybe that isn't it.

Thanks for the concrete information. I think that is a normal fire separation rating that will already exist within the building in various places (e.g., separating a fire exit stairwell from the rest of the building), so I doubt that would be the controlling issue in building links. But it definitely does underscore that links do have complexities beyond those that apply to a free-standing building.
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(02-12-2018, 02:03 PM)nms Wrote: The fire code and/or other building codes will often be a problem.  For the mall to movie theatre connection, there may also be the issue that the fire department would want to be able to get all the way around the building in the event of an emergency.  On a related note, when I took a look at Conestoga Mall in air photos, there is a very impressive solar array on top of the Zehrs.

I expect that with respect to the University of Waterloo, an internal bus waiting area will evolve when the new transit terminal is developed on the east end of campus.

I will be very surprised if we have anything more than an insufficient number of bus shelters at the new terminal. If we have covered areas comparable to the LRT stations I’ll be pleasantly surprised once I recover from the shock. Of course, what I think we really should do is plan a campus building integrated with the bus terminal (and should have done that with the LRT station too).

Campus is getting pretty well-connected these days, after at least 20 years of a policy of actually linking our buildings together. That policy replaced an earlier (apparent de facto) policy of letting each architect do whatever they wanted without regard for the setting, leading to several absurd situations where buildings faced away from each other or had a 6m gap between them.
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It looks like they are getting ready to open the new hallway at Conestoga Mall (the old Target space) very soon. They have taken out the hoarding inside the mall and have put up a curtain. Anyone hear of what stores will be opening?

Ashby Grove barber shop, Chatters Salon, MINISO, Sport Check, Suzy Shier, QE Home, & West 49 are confirmed to be opening new stores at the mall soon.
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I saw a sign at Sport Chek saying that they were moving when I was at the mall on Monday.
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(02-11-2018, 10:49 AM)ijmorlan Wrote:
(02-11-2018, 10:14 AM)tomh009 Wrote: Which city? Kitchener does have enclosed walkways from Market Square to both the old city hall and to Crown Plaza. That's not many, but greater than zero.

The Region of Waterloo. I am aware of the Kitchener links. Speaking of Kitchener, I think the whole institutional precinct from Market Square through the courthouse and over to regional headquarters and Centre in the Square is the sort of area where I would like to see indoor connections between buildings, and new buildings designed to connect to nearby buildings. It’s an area where all the buildings are large public buildings and there are lots of people. As a result, many would benefit from the links and it’s feasible for the various buildings to negotiate appropriate links. Also the cost of the links is relatively small compared to overall construction costs.

And of course installing links like this makes public transit more attractive if the walk between transit and the destination may be taken partially or entirely indoors.

But I’m not just talking about big bridges which I recognize are expensive, and depending on how and where they are constructed may have questionable aesthetics or other problems. There are many missed opportunities for smaller scale protection. I’m thinking of a strip mall with a roof in front of some of the stores. But it ends arbitrarily at a corner, and then the entrance to the office building at the end of the mall has its entrance over some distance, not connected to the roof.

Or the University, where building projects in that last couple of years provided the opportunity, not taken, to put bus waiting areas indoors, with windows allowing to see the bus coming and a roof covering most of the distance to the actual point where the bus stops.

Or the new building at Waterloo Town Square, where there is a canopy over some entrance doors but not others. It makes me think that the designer thinks of the canopy strictly as a visual architectural feature and not as a practical operational feature of the building.

And by protected walkways, I don’t just mean fully-enclosed climate-controlled walkways; I mean any sort of protection, even down to just a roof over a path to catch precipitation but not affect cold temperature or wind. St. Jerome’s has some of these; but in building their new building they inexplicably cut an existing one short so that it doesn’t reach the new building. This proves it’s not about cost; they paid extra to remove an existing roof!

I don't think this is a thing limited to ROW.  Most cities in Canada/US don't have this.  Even in TO, the PATH system is fine in the core for underground connectivity but there aren't coverings at bus and streetcar stops that let you get on/off vehicles and into buildings .

And I've wondered why shops don't typically have canopies at their entrances that would cover over the driveway to allow people to get in/out of vehicles  protected from the elements.  the Inn of Waterloo has this but I can't think of any others.  I've speculated that its because the architecture/design industry is driven by trends in the southern US and seems to ignore our climate.   Given the number of days where we have cold, snow, rain, uncomfortable heat you would think covered walkways/driveways would be be more common.
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(03-01-2018, 10:43 AM)NotStan Wrote:
(02-11-2018, 10:49 AM)ijmorlan Wrote: The Region of Waterloo. I am aware of the Kitchener links. Speaking of Kitchener, I think the whole institutional precinct from Market Square through the courthouse and over to regional headquarters and Centre in the Square is the sort of area where I would like to see indoor connections between buildings, and new buildings designed to connect to nearby buildings. It’s an area where all the buildings are large public buildings and there are lots of people. As a result, many would benefit from the links and it’s feasible for the various buildings to negotiate appropriate links. Also the cost of the links is relatively small compared to overall construction costs.

And of course installing links like this makes public transit more attractive if the walk between transit and the destination may be taken partially or entirely indoors.

But I’m not just talking about big bridges which I recognize are expensive, and depending on how and where they are constructed may have questionable aesthetics or other problems. There are many missed opportunities for smaller scale protection. I’m thinking of a strip mall with a roof in front of some of the stores. But it ends arbitrarily at a corner, and then the entrance to the office building at the end of the mall has its entrance over some distance, not connected to the roof.

Or the University, where building projects in that last couple of years provided the opportunity, not taken, to put bus waiting areas indoors, with windows allowing to see the bus coming and a roof covering most of the distance to the actual point where the bus stops.

Or the new building at Waterloo Town Square, where there is a canopy over some entrance doors but not others. It makes me think that the designer thinks of the canopy strictly as a visual architectural feature and not as a practical operational feature of the building.

And by protected walkways, I don’t just mean fully-enclosed climate-controlled walkways; I mean any sort of protection, even down to just a roof over a path to catch precipitation but not affect cold temperature or wind. St. Jerome’s has some of these; but in building their new building they inexplicably cut an existing one short so that it doesn’t reach the new building. This proves it’s not about cost; they paid extra to remove an existing roof!

I don't think this is a thing limited to ROW.  Most cities in Canada/US don't have this.  Even in TO, the PATH system is fine in the core for underground connectivity but there aren't coverings at bus and streetcar stops that let you get on/off vehicles and into buildings .

And I've wondered why shops don't typically have canopies at their entrances that would cover over the driveway to allow people to get in/out of vehicles  protected from the elements.  the Inn of Waterloo has this but I can't think of any others.  I've speculated that its because the architecture/design industry is driven by trends in the southern US and seems to ignore our climate.   Given the number of days where we have cold, snow, rain, uncomfortable heat you would think covered walkways/driveways would be be more common.

Dating myself badly here, but once upon a time, many of the shops Downtown did have retractable canopies over the storefront.  I miss them whenever I find myself on the sunny ("north") side of King St on a hot summer day - it's brutal!
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(03-01-2018, 11:42 AM)panamaniac Wrote: Dating myself badly here, but once upon a time, many of the shops Downtown did have retractable canopies over the storefront.  I miss them whenever I find myself on the sunny ("north") side of King St on a hot summer day - it's brutal!

I wonder what happened with canopies in North America. Montreal used to have a lot more too. You still see them in other parts of the world, and shopkeepers go and adjust them at appropriate times.
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(02-28-2018, 05:20 PM)Happy Wrote: It looks like they are getting ready to open the new hallway at Conestoga Mall (the old Target space) very soon. They have taken out the hoarding inside the mall and have put up a curtain. Anyone hear of what stores will be opening?

Ashby Grove barber shop, Chatters Salon, MINISO, Sport Check, Suzy Shier, QE Home, & West 49 are confirmed to be opening new stores at the mall soon.

Thanks for the update, but wow that's a sad listing. Was hoping to see some new higher-end or big-name brands go in, following up on LuLu Lemon and Apple. Four of the seven are relocates. Maybe it's strategic leasing and some new big names will fill in the old locations.
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