Highway 7 - Kitchener to Guelph

[danbrotherston]

Ask and ye shall receive...

Why do you believe it is critical? They are currently connected by a highway. They are NOT connected by frequent transit or any other mode (and this includes Breslau). Why isn't the transit the critical infra that is missing?

As for improving roads, I don't see that this improves road access. It only improves road CAPACITY...which is only needed because there is no other option.

As for Europe, yes, much of Europe is highly car centric. But even if I agreed a highway was needed, there is no reason this highway couldn't be less car centric. For example, it could have a bus with it. But wait...and this is a big one...it could have a pedestrian/bike bridge. Right now there is no way to cross the grand river in that area if you are not in a car. There is no bus, no bike lane, no sidewalk of any kind. If you cannot afford a car or are unable to drive one for any reason, you either get to risk your life walking on the side of a highway where people are routinely killed, or you get to get a fucking swimsuit on.

We are spending what will probably be on the order of a billion dollars eventually to build an entirely new route, and after that expenditure, will we have changed the only actual lack of access? Nope, same as before.

This is why it pisses me off.

Oh...and of course there's the issue of climate change destroying our society...but that's a minor side issue at best.

Investments like this will be looked on very badly by future generations. Whether those future generations are sitting on buses watching a mostly empty four lane highway go by or they are in the ruins of our former society looking at these concrete structures by firelight, is still to be seen, but either way, they will not have nice things to say about us.

Did I say Transit wan't a critical piece of infrastructure? The answer is no, I would love to see more investments in public transit. Unlike you I am not a one or the other kind of person. I would like to see us invest in both. Much like what Europe does.   

You're missing the point. We ALREADY have an investment in roads. We already have a highway (that I think should be improved) between Guelph and KW. We are building a second highway. If this was the only car route between the two cities, I'd be a lot less negative about it. I'd still argue that transit or cycling should come first, but at least you have an argument that something has to come first. Instead we are seeing the situation where driving between the two cities is the only option being further entrenched.

So your saying if they (Province or Region) included a guaranteed investment of a bus between Guelph and Kitchener using the new HWY 7 you would support the HWY?

You speak in absolutes, but I don't. Yes, obviously I would be more likely to support the project if it included a meaningful and significant transit investment.

I  do agree with the idea of pedestrian link over the Grand. I think that would be a "relatively cheap" addition to the project that could bring a lot of benefits for accessibility of biking and walking in the region. I would love for the Region to look at more Pedestrian bridges over the grand. (Snyders flats to university would be open up a huge park space to residents of Waterloo)

"Investments like this will be looked on very badly by future generations Whether those future generations are sitting on buses watching a mostly empty four lane highway" - 
 
Hahaha I know I am pissed off at my grandparents for building the conestoga parkway and so glad they decided not to build HWY 24 to brantford...... Oh wait that is not how I feel at all.   Tell me have never driven the current HWY 7 at rush hour without actually saying it.

I'm assuming this is sarcastic, but it's foolish at best. There is no guarantee the future will look like today, and actually very very strong evidence that it won't. Climate change is not a joke, it is happening. And either we solve it, by reversing a whole lot of the decisions we've made, or we don't reverse it and the future looks even less like today.

Leaving that aside, you might not be pissed at your grandparents, but your grandparents had a lot more excuses for their ignorance than we do. At this point, we have absolutely no justification for deciding to build a second highway between two cities rather than invest in any transit option at all.

And that's a moderate position...lots of people think there's no excuse for people in the 60s and 70s not to have seen what a grift car dependent sprawl is.