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King-Victoria Transit Hub
(11-20-2018, 08:36 PM)KevinL Wrote: If parking is seen as a high priority, perhaps a structure could be built on the Kaufman Lofts' surface lot and they share the access.

Exactly what I was thinking, too!
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(11-20-2018, 11:12 PM)plam Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 11:07 PM)Spokes Wrote: The region wants lots of parking here.  Imagine youre taking the train out of town for a few days, you can park there leaving your car there much like you would at the airport.

Does that really make sense? Taxi fares (or GRT fares, but not everyone does that) to Victoria and King are pretty low from pretty much everywhere in town, and probably cheaper than parking could be.

I'm not saying I agree with it (heck, I'd just take the 20) but I think I remember that was a reason they wanted a lot of on site parking
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(11-20-2018, 11:12 PM)plam Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 11:07 PM)Spokes Wrote: The region wants lots of parking here.  Imagine youre taking the train out of town for a few days, you can park there leaving your car there much like you would at the airport.

Does that really make sense? Taxi fares (or GRT fares, but not everyone does that) to Victoria and King are pretty low from pretty much everywhere in town, and probably cheaper than parking could be.

Taxi fare from Doon South was insane when I used GO/UPX to get to the airport for a weekend trip a few years back.  I could have driven to Pearson and parked in their premium lot for less, but hey, I got to ride the UPX...
...K
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(11-20-2018, 11:43 PM)tomh009 Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 08:36 PM)KevinL Wrote: If parking is seen as a high priority, perhaps a structure could be built on the Kaufman Lofts' surface lot and they share the access.

Exactly what I was thinking, too!

Underground with a nice public park on top?   Smile
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The bus bays in that early diagram are just hypothetical mock-up, not final.

I think the region is right to be more cautious on this project. This is a defining building/complex and it needs to get it right.

I am still hopeful that something like mini version of Berlin's Hauptbahnhof:
   
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berlin_Hau...ne_-_4.jpg
Everyone move to the back of the bus and we all get home faster.
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(11-20-2018, 11:07 PM)Spokes Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 04:32 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: Why not underground parking?  Or for that matter, I see little reason to have any parking here.

The region wants lots of parking here.  Imagine youre taking the train out of town for a few days, you can park there leaving your car there much like you would at the airport.

Is this an official stance anywhere?  Breslau was intended, I thought by both Metrolinx and the region, as the park and ride station.  Central station should have zero parking .
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(11-22-2018, 08:27 AM)danbrotherston Wrote:
(11-20-2018, 11:07 PM)Spokes Wrote: The region wants lots of parking here.  Imagine youre taking the train out of town for a few days, you can park there leaving your car there much like you would at the airport.

Is this an official stance anywhere?  Breslau was intended, I thought by both Metrolinx and the region, as the park and ride station.  Central station should have zero parking .

I thought I saw it somewhere, but likely not from the Region.

As for zero parking, this seems ridiculous.  I know you hate parking minimums and parking in general, but people drive cars.  That's the reality of our society.  So there should be some parking.  That combined with the fact that that end of downtown could use a public parking garage long term makes this make sense at this location.
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What about the huge piece of land the city (or region) owns south (behind) the school of pharmacy?  Surely that could be a large parking resource tucked out of sight and a short 50-100m walk to the station.  

Forcing parking onto the (smallish) transit hub lands would probably result in what we are seeing everywhere which is 3-4 floors of structured parking above grade in order to get the density that makes the projects work.
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(11-22-2018, 10:46 AM)REnerd Wrote: What about the huge piece of land the city (or region) owns south (behind) the school of pharmacy?  Surely that could be a large parking resource tucked out of sight and a short 50-100m walk to the station.  

Forcing parking onto the (smallish) transit hub lands would probably result in what we are seeing everywhere which is 3-4 floors of structured parking above grade in order to get the density that makes the projects work.

You mean, along King to the...west/north ish?  That land is apparently highly contaminated to the point it has negative value...
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(11-22-2018, 09:52 AM)Spokes Wrote:
(11-22-2018, 08:27 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: Is this an official stance anywhere?  Breslau was intended, I thought by both Metrolinx and the region, as the park and ride station.  Central station should have zero parking .

I thought I saw it somewhere, but likely not from the Region.

As for zero parking, this seems ridiculous.  I know you hate parking minimums and parking in general, but people drive cars.  That's the reality of our society.  So there should be some parking.  That combined with the fact that that end of downtown could use a public parking garage long term makes this make sense at this location.

So, parking minimums and parking are two different things.  I think there should be no parking minimums anywhere.  Developers should provide exactly as much parking as the market demands.

And I agree, most places, this will be more than zero.

But at the central transit station, this is the one place in the city, where I'd argue that zero is reasonable, but obviously, this is only my opinion.

There's another issue which you allude to which is combined parking (instead of each use having their own parking), which is a no brainer downtown, and whether you think there's insufficient parking in that area of downtown is a reasonable question.
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(11-22-2018, 11:57 AM)danbrotherston Wrote:
(11-22-2018, 10:46 AM)REnerd Wrote: What about the huge piece of land the city (or region) owns south (behind) the school of pharmacy?  Surely that could be a large parking resource tucked out of sight and a short 50-100m walk to the station.  

Forcing parking onto the (smallish) transit hub lands would probably result in what we are seeing everywhere which is 3-4 floors of structured parking above grade in order to get the density that makes the projects work.

You mean, along King to the...west/north ish?  That land is apparently highly contaminated to the point it has negative value...

Isn't it owned by UW too?
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(11-22-2018, 12:00 PM)danbrotherston Wrote:
(11-22-2018, 09:52 AM)Spokes Wrote: I thought I saw it somewhere, but likely not from the Region.

As for zero parking, this seems ridiculous.  I know you hate parking minimums and parking in general, but people drive cars.  That's the reality of our society.  So there should be some parking.  That combined with the fact that that end of downtown could use a public parking garage long term makes this make sense at this location.

So, parking minimums and parking are two different things.  I think there should be no parking minimums anywhere.  Developers should provide exactly as much parking as the market demands.

And I agree, most places, this will be more than zero.

But at the central transit station, this is the one place in the city, where I'd argue that zero is reasonable, but obviously, this is only my opinion.

There's another issue which you allude to which is combined parking (instead of each use having their own parking), which is a no brainer downtown, and whether you think there's insufficient parking in that area of downtown is a reasonable question.

You're absolutely right, minimums don't apply here.  And they have their own issues.

I get the argument for not having parking there.  If anywhere, it makes sense there.  I just don't think it makes sense, but thats just me.  What's the closest public garage?  Ontario St?
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(11-22-2018, 12:24 PM)Spokes Wrote:
(11-22-2018, 11:57 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: You mean, along King to the...west/north ish?  That land is apparently highly contaminated to the point it has negative value...

Isn't it owned by UW too?

I don't believe so.  There is want to put the IHT to Transit Centre trail through here, but that isn't going to happen any time soon...when it was discussed though, the question was could the trail be put in without cleaning up, the company being discussed wasn't UW or the City/Region.
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Sorry, I'm confused, which land is this? Just above Victoria between King and Joseph?
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(11-22-2018, 12:29 PM)Spokes Wrote:
(11-22-2018, 12:00 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: So, parking minimums and parking are two different things.  I think there should be no parking minimums anywhere.  Developers should provide exactly as much parking as the market demands.

And I agree, most places, this will be more than zero.

But at the central transit station, this is the one place in the city, where I'd argue that zero is reasonable, but obviously, this is only my opinion.

There's another issue which you allude to which is combined parking (instead of each use having their own parking), which is a no brainer downtown, and whether you think there's insufficient parking in that area of downtown is a reasonable question.

You're absolutely right, minimums don't apply here.  And they have their own issues.

I get the argument for not having parking there.  If anywhere, it makes sense there.  I just don't think it makes sense, but thats just me.  What's the closest public garage?  Ontario St?

Are the parking minimums zero?  That would be great if they aren't any, but I'd be a little surprised if that was the case.

The nearest parking garage is probably city hall (King/Young), but there are closer public parking lots (King/Francis), which could be developed into garages if needed.  There are also literally a dozen private parking lots which are closer, which again comes to the stupidity of requiring parking for each use in a downtown core...The Kaufman lofts have a huge surface parking lot, that's half empty at the same time a public garage would be half full.

Broadly, as a resident (and taxpayer) it just ticks me off that I look at a giant, mostly empty parking garage (Charles/Benton) all day, while I hear about how much more parking is needed downtown.  I'm not against parking, but there are enormous costs to too much parking, and having parking minimums is achieving exactly that.
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