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A Better Tent City
#31
(06-03-2021, 02:15 PM)creative Wrote: Is there no available city or regional space downtown where this could be relocated? Closer to services and transit! YIMBY?

Won't be Waterloo for sure! Oh wait...that's "Uptown"....
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#32
Based on their experience and set up at Lot42, among other items they sought was 24-hour access to washroom facilities. Using a (former) industrial site meant that they had such access. I'm not sure what sites in Uptown Waterloo would meet that criteria. The only site I could think of in Waterloo at the moment is the former Waterloo Manufacturing site at Phillip, Albert and Hazel St, but those buildings have generally been torn down.
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#33
(06-05-2021, 11:32 PM)nms Wrote: Based on their experience and set up at Lot42, among other items they sought was 24-hour access to washroom facilities.  Using a (former) industrial site meant that they had such access. I'm not sure what sites in Uptown Waterloo would meet that criteria. The only site I could think of in Waterloo at the moment is the former Waterloo Manufacturing site at Phillip, Albert and Hazel St, but those buildings have generally been torn down.

Won't happen anywhere in Waterloo...ever. Not "their" problem. When I worked in DTK, the City of Waterloo By-Law would have WRPS pick-up the homeless in Waterloo and drop them off in DTK. Happened at least once a week. These people weren't doing anything illegal, Waterloo just didn't want them in their city.

Hopefully they can find a good spot though.
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#34
(06-06-2021, 07:27 PM)jeffster Wrote:
(06-05-2021, 11:32 PM)nms Wrote: Based on their experience and set up at Lot42, among other items they sought was 24-hour access to washroom facilities.  Using a (former) industrial site meant that they had such access. I'm not sure what sites in Uptown Waterloo would meet that criteria. The only site I could think of in Waterloo at the moment is the former Waterloo Manufacturing site at Phillip, Albert and Hazel St, but those buildings have generally been torn down.

Won't happen anywhere in Waterloo...ever. Not "their" problem. When I worked in DTK, the City of Waterloo By-Law would have WRPS pick-up the homeless in Waterloo and drop them off in DTK. Happened at least once a week. These people weren't doing anything illegal, Waterloo just didn't want them in their city.

Hopefully they can find a good spot though.

Do you have documentation of this kind of thing.  

And I'm not suggesting I don't believe, I completely do, I just feel like this kind of story would make a big news story if there was proof, and frankly, it would be an important story to tell.
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#35
(06-06-2021, 09:09 PM)danbrotherston Wrote:
(06-06-2021, 07:27 PM)jeffster Wrote: Won't happen anywhere in Waterloo...ever. Not "their" problem. When I worked in DTK, the City of Waterloo By-Law would have WRPS pick-up the homeless in Waterloo and drop them off in DTK. Happened at least once a week. These people weren't doing anything illegal, Waterloo just didn't want them in their city.

Hopefully they can find a good spot though.

Do you have documentation of this kind of thing.  

And I'm not suggesting I don't believe, I completely do, I just feel like this kind of story would make a big news story if there was proof, and frankly, it would be an important story to tell.

I wasn’t part of the department that likely handled this (Corporate Security for City of Kitchener).

My understanding was that some of the homeless and/or sheltered individuals would normally be receiving services in Kitchener as Waterloo doesn’t help ‘these kinds of people’. But my opinion, if they’re not doing harm (other than making asking people for money), then they should have freedom to walk around the cities.
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#36
(06-07-2021, 07:53 AM)jeffster Wrote:
(06-06-2021, 09:09 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: Do you have documentation of this kind of thing.  

And I'm not suggesting I don't believe, I completely do, I just feel like this kind of story would make a big news story if there was proof, and frankly, it would be an important story to tell.

I wasn’t part of the department that likely handled this (Corporate Security for City of Kitchener).

My understanding was that some of the homeless and/or sheltered individuals would normally be receiving services in Kitchener as Waterloo doesn’t help ‘these kinds of people’. But my opinion, if they’re not doing harm (other than making asking people for money), then they should have freedom to walk around the cities.

I mean...yeah. It can be your opinion, and mine too, but it's also like, a guarantee of the charter, lol. We shouldn't be forcefully relocating people. Seems old habits die hard.
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#37
Kitchener (no surprise here) has offered to house A Better Tent City at one of their sites, the Battler Road snow storage. They'll have the until the end of October. There are washrooms on site at this facility. It's a temp solution until Kitchener can find a better option.
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#38
That would be better than the previous option out in Breslau, though it's still pretty far away from anything. There aren't too many bus routes out there for those people to get around to stores or access services but at least they would have something. It's also good to see the City of Kitchener - once again - stepping up to take the lead in our region while the rest of the cities quietly look away.

This just really goes to show we need to solve homelessness, improve mental health and solve the housing crisis. We can't perpetually stick people in sheds for a few months of the year in the middle of nowhere. It feels like we're kicking these people to the curb. Out of sight, out of mind.
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#39
(06-17-2021, 10:47 AM)ac3r Wrote: That would be better than the previous option out in Breslau, though it's still pretty far away from anything. There aren't too many bus routes out there for those people to get around to stores or access services but at least they would have something. It's also good to see the City of Kitchener - once again - stepping up to take the lead in our region while the rest of the cities quietly look away.

This just really goes to show we need to solve homelessness, improve mental health and solve the housing crisis. We can't perpetually stick people in sheds for a few months of the year in the middle of nowhere. It feels like we're kicking these people to the curb. Out of sight, out of mind.

100% agree with everything you said. It is a shame, though, that the other cities and townships, especially the city of Waterloo, don't want to help the less fortunate. I mean, what kind of people do they have in that city that they can wilfully neglect segments of population and be proud of that fact?
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#40
Let's see if people start bringing up the fact that its right near Huron Heights Secondary School.
Nonethlesss I'm glad that the city has stepped up. This is a better area with Bus Access to Route 16 and there is a Circle K convenience store across the road.
Route 16 is pretty good for access to services such as Pioneer Park Plaza, Forest Glen Plaza and Belmont Village.
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#41
(06-17-2021, 10:47 AM)ac3r Wrote: That would be better than the previous option out in Breslau, though it's still pretty far away from anything. There aren't too many bus routes out there for those people to get around to stores or access services but at least they would have something. It's also good to see the City of Kitchener - once again - stepping up to take the lead in our region while the rest of the cities quietly look away.

This just really goes to show we need to solve homelessness, improve mental health and solve the housing crisis. We can't perpetually stick people in sheds for a few months of the year in the middle of nowhere. It feels like we're kicking these people to the curb. Out of sight, out of mind.

Is it a better option? It's more temporary, with less continuity. There was also suggestion from the residents that they felt living in a rural area would give them options they wouldn't get in a non-rural setting.

I do agree it's closer, btu it is also highly inaccessible, and assuming we know what's best for these folks is part of the continuing problem.

I am glad they will not be forced into homelessness (as they are not homeless now) by the fears and anger of wealthy property owners in Breslau and Maryhill.
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#42
(06-17-2021, 12:02 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: Is it a better option? It's more temporary, with less continuity. There was also suggestion from the residents that they felt living in a rural area would give them options they wouldn't get in a non-rural setting.

I do agree it's closer, btu it is also highly inaccessible, and assuming we know what's best for these folks is part of the continuing problem.

I am glad they will not be forced into homelessness (as they are not homeless now) by the fears and anger of wealthy property owners in Breslau and Maryhill.

Naturally, I can't speak for the people living there, but my immediate concerns regarding Breslau was the distance from the core of the city. It's one of the furthest suburbs we have and (as far as I know) does not have any bus routes out there. This would really impact the people who need to continually access services in the city. Perhaps they were drafting plans to offer a shuttle, which would help, but I don't know.

The rural setting may have seemed better. I don't think any of us can speak regarding their needs. But even still, it's a significant walk to any nearby shops whether they needed supplies, public wi-fi, libraries, socialization, immediate policing/medical care or just somewhere to momentarily cool down indoors this summer. I assume their small homes don't have luxuries like air conditioning...I would hope they at least have power.

Unfortunately yes, the wealthy residents out there were objecting to this which is sad to see. These are not exactly junkies looking to break into cars and sheds to steal things for fentanyl, which was the main complaint three residents had (crime). Most are just people down on their luck, not able to afford a proper apartment, but who may not necessarily want to live in a tent or anything like that. A place like this is a step up from the usual truly homeless lifestyle where you not only need to worry about the elements harming you, but other people. This Kitchener site may be temporary, but so was the Breslau one. I'd rather see them be guaranteed a place to stay for a few months rather than have the region search only to find nothing.
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#43
(06-17-2021, 01:27 PM)ac3r Wrote:
(06-17-2021, 12:02 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: Is it a better option? It's more temporary, with less continuity. There was also suggestion from the residents that they felt living in a rural area would give them options they wouldn't get in a non-rural setting.

Naturally, I can't speak for the people living there, but my immediate concerns regarding Breslau was the distance from the core of the city. It's one of the furthest suburbs we have and (as far as I know) does not have any bus routes out there. This would really impact the people who need to continually access services in the city. Perhaps they were drafting plans to offer a shuttle, which would help, but I don't know.

ABTC would have provided the residents with transportation as well as on-site services. The issue was the rejection by the Breslau community, not a rejection by the residents.
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#44
(06-17-2021, 01:27 PM)ac3r Wrote:
(06-17-2021, 12:02 PM)danbrotherston Wrote: Is it a better option? It's more temporary, with less continuity. There was also suggestion from the residents that they felt living in a rural area would give them options they wouldn't get in a non-rural setting.

I do agree it's closer, btu it is also highly inaccessible, and assuming we know what's best for these folks is part of the continuing problem.

I am glad they will not be forced into homelessness (as they are not homeless now) by the fears and anger of wealthy property owners in Breslau and Maryhill.

Naturally, I can't speak for the people living there, but my immediate concerns regarding Breslau was the distance from the core of the city. It's one of the furthest suburbs we have and (as far as I know) does not have any bus routes out there. This would really impact the people who need to continually access services in the city. Perhaps they were drafting plans to offer a shuttle, which would help, but I don't know.

The rural setting may have seemed better. I don't think any of us can speak regarding their needs. But even still, it's a significant walk to any nearby shops whether they needed supplies, public wi-fi, libraries, socialization, immediate policing/medical care or just somewhere to momentarily cool down indoors this summer. I assume their small homes don't have luxuries like air conditioning...I would hope they at least have power.

Unfortunately yes, the wealthy residents out there were objecting to this which is sad to see. These are not exactly junkies looking to break into cars and sheds to steal things for fentanyl, which was the main complaint three residents had (crime). Most are just people down on their luck, not able to afford a proper apartment, but who may not necessarily want to live in a tent or anything like that. A place like this is a step up from the usual truly homeless lifestyle where you not only need to worry about the elements harming you, but other people. This Kitchener site may be temporary, but so was the Breslau one. I'd rather see them be guaranteed a place to stay for a few months rather than have the region search only to find nothing.

I also did not know how they would be provided needed services, I asked, and as tomh mentions, they did think about and have solutions for those challenges, and I was happy that they had considered and managed those challenges.

The very fact that we are discussing "what's best" for those people is, I think, problematic. They need to be at the table at a minimum. Were they in the Woolwich council meeting? I don't think so. Why was no effort made to include them in the discussion. Regardless of what the best, or even any feasible option is, the residents should be given agency in that decision--at least the same as any other resident of our community.

The Breslau site was "temporary" but in a different scale than the Kitchener option...in Kitchener, they must be out by October (presumably for snow clearing operations), but in Breslau I don't think there was an end date AFAIK.

As for the resident response, calling it "objecting" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. There was some extremely venomous fear and hate spewed about these people. To the point that they were explicitly accused of being child predators. I find that incredibly frustrating and saddening, and frankly embarrassing that a community would, en masse have such a hateful fearful response to people in our community without the slightest attempt to understand.
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#45
https://kitchener.ctvnews.ca/neighbours-...-1.5477892
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