General Suburban Updates and Rumours

[rangersfan]

Residents in the Doon area are fearful of a new senior's apartment proposal...........students.

https://www.therecord.com/news-story/970...t-housing/

[KevinL]

Well, if they actually allowed proper student housing in the neighborhood then they wouldn't have to worry about it arriving by stealth.

But for some reason student housing shouldn't exist next to a college, apparently.

[ijmorlan]

Well, if they actually allowed proper student housing in the neighborhood then they wouldn't have to worry about it arriving by stealth.

But for some reason student housing shouldn't exist next to a college, apparently.

Very true.

Funny question though, why doesn’t Conestoga College just build a bunch of student residences? Don’t they have tons of space there? And it would fix their traffic/parking problems. There shouldn’t be any zoning issues because their land is already zoned for post-secondary institution, and student residences are part of having a post-secondary institution.

[danbrotherston]

Well, if they actually allowed proper student housing in the neighborhood then they wouldn't have to worry about it arriving by stealth.

But for some reason student housing shouldn't exist next to a college, apparently.

Very true.

Funny question though, why doesn’t Conestoga College just build a bunch of student residences? Don’t they have tons of space there? And it would fix their traffic/parking problems. There shouldn’t be any zoning issues because their land is already zoned for post-secondary institution, and student residences are part of having a post-secondary institution.

I don't think that would actually solve the problem, Laurier and UW both have residences, and yet the surrounding area is also filled with student housing.  Students don't want to be (and shouldn't be) segregated off in the school campus.

It's also worth noting that I don't think there are any ammenities on the constoga campus, UW and Laurier aren't great either, but they have 24/7 food, and medical facilities on campus, and other services like dental, hair, etc. very nearby.  Constoga college is far more isolated, even Doon is not great, but it's less isolated than the college.

[ijmorlan]

Very true.

Funny question though, why doesn’t Conestoga College just build a bunch of student residences? Don’t they have tons of space there? And it would fix their traffic/parking problems. There shouldn’t be any zoning issues because their land is already zoned for post-secondary institution, and student residences are part of having a post-secondary institution.

I don't think that would actually solve the problem, Laurier and UW both have residences, and yet the surrounding area is also filled with student housing.  Students don't want to be (and shouldn't be) segregated off in the school campus.

It's also worth noting that I don't think there are any ammenities on the constoga campus, UW and Laurier aren't great either, but they have 24/7 food, and medical facilities on campus, and other services like dental, hair, etc. very nearby.  Constoga college is far more isolated, even Doon is not great, but it's less isolated than the college.

Depends how much you build. UW has only added MKV and CMH since I came in 1993, and REV was built in approximately 1965 as far as I can tell. If they had continued to build more residences, presumably not as many student apartments would have been created in nearby locations.

That’s not to say that the best solution is to keep building residences until they never fill up (although that is the approach we take to parking, but I digress), but my point is that if there is demand for housing right next to campus then presumably there is demand for housing right on campus, and there might be less trouble with zoning nonsense.

The point about amenities is well taken. That Conestoga College campus is pretty much in the middle of nowhere. Even so, living close to class would likely be desireable for many students, even if they needed to hop in a car or take an interminable bus ride to get to entertainment and grocery options.

[danbrotherston]

I don't think that would actually solve the problem, Laurier and UW both have residences, and yet the surrounding area is also filled with student housing.  Students don't want to be (and shouldn't be) segregated off in the school campus.

It's also worth noting that I don't think there are any ammenities on the constoga campus, UW and Laurier aren't great either, but they have 24/7 food, and medical facilities on campus, and other services like dental, hair, etc. very nearby.  Constoga college is far more isolated, even Doon is not great, but it's less isolated than the college.

Depends how much you build. UW has only added MKV and CMH since I came in 1993, and REV was built in approximately 1965 as far as I can tell. If they had continued to build more residences, presumably not as many student apartments would have been created in nearby locations.

That’s not to say that the best solution is to keep building residences until they never fill up (although that is the approach we take to parking, but I digress), but my point is that if there is demand for housing right next to campus then presumably there is demand for housing right on campus, and there might be less trouble with zoning nonsense.

The point about amenities is well taken. That Conestoga College campus is pretty much in the middle of nowhere. Even so, living close to class would likely be desireable for many students, even if they needed to hop in a car or take an interminable bus ride to get to entertainment and grocery options.

Possibly, but I suspect most students in second year and beyond would prefer not to live in dorms, or on campus, even at UW, even if it was available. To be honest, I have no idea what the student life at Conestoga is, it's so remote, I cannot imagine most students there find any street life to enjoy at all, even UW with it's multiple surrounding highways has a more interesting street life for students.

And I do still believe that segregating students in the campus is bad for the community. Not only does unfamiliarity make it easier for people in the community to resent, it also makes it easier for students to leave when they finish, as they will have no attachment to the community, and one of the biggest assets for any community is skilled workers, we really don't want them to leave.

I do think this is one of the biggest advantages of the LRT, is that it will allow students to more easily live elsewhere in the region, and become a part of the community in their later years and be more likely to stay.

[jwilliamson]

Depends how much you build. UW has only added MKV and CMH since I came in 1993, and REV was built in approximately 1965 as far as I can tell. If they had continued to build more residences, presumably not as many student apartments would have been created in nearby locations.

There's also a new tower at UWP, and at least Grebel and St. Jerome's have had major expansions in the last few years.

[ijmorlan]

Depends how much you build. UW has only added MKV and CMH since I came in 1993, and REV was built in approximately 1965 as far as I can tell. If they had continued to build more residences, presumably not as many student apartments would have been created in nearby locations.

There's also a new tower at UWP, and at least Grebel and St. Jerome's have had major expansions in the last few years.

I believe the only new tower at UWP is CMH. Have they built another newer tower?

I’m pretty confident Grebel has added less than 100 beds since 1993. St. Paul’s, Renison, and St. Jerome’s have all added some, but even so, it’s not proportional to the size of the institution. Overall, it’s a change in approach. In the 60s, it seems to have been assumed that a large fraction of students would live in residence; now, it is assumed that only a small minority will live in residence.

I don’t particularly have an opinion on which is better, although there is something to be said for students to concentrate on their studies, not worry about dealing with groceries and landlords. On the other hand, the idea that residence is a good place to concentrate on ones studies is somewhat hilarious. I also take Dan’s point above that it’s good for students to integrate into the larger community. Of course that can be done in many ways; and I think entertainment and leisure activities may be more important for that than whether the apartment building one lives in, full of students, is owned by the University or by a rental company.

In any case my original point was that if students want apartment buildings close to Conestoga College, and developers are having trouble building them due to zoning and NIMBY problems, it might make sense for Conestoga College to use some of its space to build residence buildings. And this would indeed reduce traffic associated with classes, as everybody in residence could just walk to their classes. Indeed, with careful design, they could do so without even going outside. So you would split the existing traffic all around class time into two smaller sets of traffic, some around class time from students who don’t live in residence, and some at other times from students who do live in residence going out to other activities.

[danbrotherston]

There's also a new tower at UWP, and at least Grebel and St. Jerome's have had major expansions in the last few years.

I believe the only new tower at UWP is CMH. Have they built another newer tower?

I’m pretty confident Grebel has added less than 100 beds since 1993. St. Paul’s, Renison, and St. Jerome’s have all added some, but even so, it’s not proportional to the size of the institution. Overall, it’s a change in approach. In the 60s, it seems to have been assumed that a large fraction of students would live in residence; now, it is assumed that only a small minority will live in residence.

....

I'm not sure what the strategy was in the 1960s, but the strategy today, or at least as of a few years ago, was that everyone in first year would have the opportunity to live in residence, and most (who didn't live at home) would do so. After first year, it was expected students would move out of residence, they had only one small dedicated upper year residence (which is no longer generally available, it's some kind of business program) as well as the dons in the first year residences.

I know they struggled to make room, they converted REV to 3 student rooms (which wasn't very popular) and they rented space from a Laurier residence near Laurier (which was even less popular), so I'm not sure what their numbers are these days in terms of first years in residence, but I'd bet it's still a majority.

[ijmorlan]

I'm not sure what the strategy was in the 1960s, but the strategy today, or at least as of a few years ago, was that everyone in first year would have the opportunity to live in residence, and most (who didn't live at home) would do so. After first year, it was expected students would move out of residence, they had only one small dedicated upper year residence (which is no longer generally available, it's some kind of business program) as well as the dons in the first year residences.

If you’re referring to the Minota Hagey residence, it was for grad students. Now it is Velocity.

I believe the Villages were for undergrads. Now my understanding is that space is guaranteed for 1st year students, with any remaining space available for upper-year students. I don’t know how the numbers actually work out, and I don’t know how policies changed with the opening of CMH.

[jwilliamson]

I'm not sure what the strategy was in the 1960s, but the strategy today, or at least as of a few years ago, was that everyone in first year would have the opportunity to live in residence, and most (who didn't live at home) would do so. After first year, it was expected students would move out of residence, they had only one small dedicated upper year residence (which is no longer generally available, it's some kind of business program) as well as the dons in the first year residences.

If you’re referring to the Minota Hagey residence, it was for grad students. Now it is Velocity.

There's also a small residence by MKV that I believe was reserved for married students. I'm not sure what it's used for now.

[plam]

I'm not sure what the strategy was in the 1960s, but the strategy today, or at least as of a few years ago, was that everyone in first year would have the opportunity to live in residence, and most (who didn't live at home) would do so. After first year, it was expected students would move out of residence, they had only one small dedicated upper year residence (which is no longer generally available, it's some kind of business program) as well as the dons in the first year residences.

I know they struggled to make room, they converted REV to 3 student rooms (which wasn't very popular) and they rented space from a Laurier residence near Laurier (which was even less popular), so I'm not sure what their numbers are these days in terms of first years in residence, but I'd bet it's still a majority.

They would also like to encourage a limited number of upper year students to stay in residence to counterbalance "it's all dons and first year students". There is some space, but not enough for everyone. In general, UW Residences is aware that they're in a competitive market for housing.

[white_brian]

The old fire house now day care has been demolished at Block Line and Westmount Rd

[panamaniac]

The old fire house now day care has been demolished at Block Line and Westmount Rd

New day care?  Seniors' residence expansion?

[ZEBuilder]

The old fire house now day care has been demolished at Block Line and Westmount Rd

New day care?  Seniors' residence expansion?

5 floor long term care facility as an addition to the retirement home.