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+--- Thread: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours (/showthread.php?tid=7)
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - danbrotherston - 05-03-2023
(05-02-2023, 07:08 PM)nms Wrote: St Benedict's has a rubber track too. But St. Mary's does not (according to Google's satellite view). It may be that the Catholic Board has different infrastructure priorities funding to the Public Board.
Fixed that for you
...FWIW...I don't really know much about the funding, I always got the sense they got money from the Church, but I have no idea. What I do know is that when I was growing up is the Catholic schools were *MUCH* nicer than the public schools I saw in London...so this does not surprise me.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - Chris - 05-03-2023
(05-03-2023, 12:46 AM)danbrotherston Wrote:(05-02-2023, 07:08 PM)nms Wrote: St Benedict's has a rubber track too. But St. Mary's does not (according to Google's satellite view). It may be that the Catholic Board has different infrastructure priorities funding to the Public Board.
Fixed that for you
FWIW...I don't really know much about the funding, I always got the sense they got money from the Church, but I have no idea. What I do know is that when I was growing up is the Catholic schools were *MUCH* nicer than the public schools I saw in London...so this does not surprise me.
When you buy a house and start paying property taxes you pick which school board your want to support.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - danbrotherston - 05-03-2023
(05-03-2023, 12:30 PM)Chris Wrote:(05-03-2023, 12:46 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: Fixed that for you
FWIW...I don't really know much about the funding, I always got the sense they got money from the Church, but I have no idea. What I do know is that when I was growing up is the Catholic schools were *MUCH* nicer than the public schools I saw in London...so this does not surprise me.
When you buy a house and start paying property taxes you pick which school board your want to support.
Having bought a house, I do know that. But it doesn't really matter, because people will fund the board their children will attend. Unless there is a high propensity for childless people to fund the Catholic board for some reason (which seems unlikely given the Catholic view on children).
That doesn't explain their apparent higher level of funding.
Like I said, my impression was that they were getting additional funding from the church on top of what they get through the public purse.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - Acitta - 05-03-2023
(05-03-2023, 12:30 PM)Chris Wrote:(05-03-2023, 12:46 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: Fixed that for you
FWIW...I don't really know much about the funding, I always got the sense they got money from the Church, but I have no idea. What I do know is that when I was growing up is the Catholic schools were *MUCH* nicer than the public schools I saw in London...so this does not surprise me.
When you buy a house and start paying property taxes you pick which school board your want to support.
You do that in elections even if you don't own a house or have children.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - jeffster - 05-03-2023
(05-03-2023, 12:30 PM)Chris Wrote:(05-03-2023, 12:46 AM)danbrotherston Wrote: Fixed that for you
FWIW...I don't really know much about the funding, I always got the sense they got money from the Church, but I have no idea. What I do know is that when I was growing up is the Catholic schools were *MUCH* nicer than the public schools I saw in London...so this does not surprise me.
When you buy a house and start paying property taxes you pick which school board your want to support.
I don't think that has been the case for a long time. I think it used to be on the "Ontario" portion of the tax return, years ago. IIRC, I think it was Rae who got ride of that, but I could be wrong.
Now-a-days, most funding comes from property taxes, and is a per-pupil funding method. Whether the Catholic schools get extra money from the Church I have no idea. Also, now-a-days, you can send your kid to whatever secondary school you want within that school boundary (with exceptions) - kids don't need to be Catholic, believe in God or whatever, to go to a Catholic high school. JK - grade 8 can also attend with permission.
Unsure if the secondary schools are any better than the public schools - just based on where most lockdowns and fight occur.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - ijmorlan - 05-04-2023
(05-03-2023, 05:50 PM)jeffster Wrote:(05-03-2023, 12:30 PM)Chris Wrote: When you buy a house and start paying property taxes you pick which school board your want to support.
I don't think that has been the case for a long time. I think it used to be on the "Ontario" portion of the tax return, years ago. IIRC, I think it was Rae who got ride of that, but I could be wrong.
Now-a-days, most funding comes from property taxes, and is a per-pupil funding method. Whether the Catholic schools get extra money from the Church I have no idea. Also, now-a-days, you can send your kid to whatever secondary school you want within that school boundary (with exceptions) - kids don't need to be Catholic, believe in God or whatever, to go to a Catholic high school. JK - grade 8 can also attend with permission.
Unsure if the secondary schools are any better than the public schools - just based on where most lockdowns and fight occur.
Yes, there is still a property tax election. Every so often they send around a notification allowing occupants of the property to direct their education taxes. I think it’s actually supposed to be the occupants, not owner, in the case of rental properties, who determine which board (public, Catholic, French public, or French Catholic) they support, but I don’t know exactly how that works. And it makes me wonder how that applies to non-residential properties; do they have an educational portion of the property tax? Personally I think education funding should be moved to the income tax.
Here’s some information:
https://www.mpac.ca/en/MakingChangesUpdates/SchoolSupportDesignation
Which actually, combined with what you said, makes me wonder if the school support actually controls the budget. Maybe it only controls which board’s trustees you can vote for? Is that what you’re saying?
Of course, we should merge the Catholic boards into their corresponding public boards. There is no conceivable justification for having a special publicly supported system for one particular religious group. The argument that it is in the constitution is bogus for two reasons: (1) the constitution can be amended and (2) we seem to have eliminated publicly funded schools for protestant families with no trouble (they are now the public boards, except in Penetanguishene) and I’m pretty sure they were constitutionally entitled to schools also.
Failing that, they should be required to teach the exact same curriculum in health class as in the public board. Catholic teachings should be required to be restricted exclusively to religious studies classes. Fortunately, Biology class should already be OK as the Catholics are not (institutionally) creationists.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - KevinL - 05-04-2023
At the time these were set up, the public board WAS the protestant board; it was presumed those schools would welcome those few minor religious groups that also existed at the time. Of course, as time wore on, it became much more of a mosaic of beliefs and non-beliefs, while the catholic boards have remained stubbornly themselves.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - tomh009 - 05-06-2023
(05-04-2023, 11:58 AM)ijmorlan Wrote: Of course, we should merge the Catholic boards into their corresponding public boards. There is no conceivable justification for having a special publicly supported system for one particular religious group. The argument that it is in the constitution is bogus for two reasons: (1) the constitution can be amended and (2) we seem to have eliminated publicly funded schools for protestant families with no trouble (they are now the public boards, except in Penetanguishene) and I’m pretty sure they were constitutionally entitled to schools also.
So, it is in the constitution, in the original 1867 BNA Act portion, and, in particular, it applies to Ontario:
Quote:93 In and for each Province the Legislature may exclusively make Laws in relation to Education, subject and according to the following Provisions:
1.
Nothing in any such Law shall prejudicially affect any Right or Privilege with respect to Denominational Schools which any Class of Persons have by Law in the Province at the Union;
2.
All the Powers, Privileges, and Duties at the Union by Law conferred and imposed in Upper Canada on the Separate Schools and School Trustees of the Queen’s Roman Catholic Subjects shall be and the same are hereby extended to the Dissentient Schools of the Queen’s Protestant and Roman Catholic Subjects in Quebec;
Yes, the constitution can be amended, in principle. The last two attempts both failed, though, and the current odds of a successful amendment are very long given that we have several rather intransigent provinces.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - ijmorlan - 05-07-2023
(05-06-2023, 09:07 PM)tomh009 Wrote: Yes, the constitution can be amended, in principle. The last two attempts both failed, though, and the current odds of a successful amendment are very long given that we have several rather intransigent provinces.
Thanks for digging that up. Weird how Quebec is defined in terms of Ontario in that last provision.
I’m pretty sure the constitution can be amended in matters that affect only a single province without everybody else having a say. This would affect only Ontario so as long as the federal government agreed I think it would be OK. Also, if Quebec and Newfoundland can do it why can’t Ontario?
And of course funding for separate schools only went to Grade 10 until 1985, so this part could be rolled back without any constitutional amendment.
Another partial measure that might be possible would be to interpret the human rights parts of the constitution as taking priority over the catholic funding part, meaning that, for example, the catholic boards might be required to take the same stance on LGBTQ issues as the public boards. They can teach Catholic dogma in religion class, but school policies shouldn’t be informed by Catholic bigotry.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - jwilliamson - 05-07-2023
(05-06-2023, 09:07 PM)tomh009 Wrote: Yes, the constitution can be amended, in principle. The last two attempts both failed, though, and the current odds of a successful amendment are very long given that we have several rather intransigent provinces.
There were four amendments passed in 2022. If Ontario wanted to get rid of Catholic schools, I'm doubtful the other provinces would put up much of a fight.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - plam - 05-08-2023
(05-07-2023, 11:57 AM)jwilliamson Wrote:(05-06-2023, 09:07 PM)tomh009 Wrote: Yes, the constitution can be amended, in principle. The last two attempts both failed, though, and the current odds of a successful amendment are very long given that we have several rather intransigent provinces.
There were four amendments passed in 2022. If Ontario wanted to get rid of Catholic schools, I'm doubtful the other provinces would put up much of a fight.
Yes. We're not the US. I went to a Protestant School Board of Greater Montreal school when I was a kid, and that board doesn't exist anymore.
Wikipedia says: "According to s. 43, any amendment applying to one or more, but not all, provinces must be "authorized by resolution of the Senate and House of Commons and of the legislative assembly of each province to which the amendment applies."[7]"
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - Watdot - 06-05-2023
Looks like Waterloo is going to have an Office to Residential conversion of its own.
https://www.engagewr.ca/180-king-street-south-z-23-05
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - westwardloo - 06-05-2023
(06-05-2023, 10:04 AM)Watdot Wrote: Looks like Waterloo is going to have an Office to Residential conversion of its own.
https://www.engagewr.ca/180-king-street-south-z-23-05
Nice to see a conversion of this underused office space. Unfortunate looking design, but at least they included ground floor retail.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - ac3r - 06-05-2023
If it were my choice, I'd keep the original brutalist/modernist design rather than a recladding that will make it look like everything else.
RE: General Urban Waterloo Updates and Rumours - tomh009 - 06-05-2023
(06-05-2023, 01:06 PM)ac3r Wrote: If it were my choice, I'd keep the original brutalist/modernist design rather than a recladding that will make it look like everything else.
It looks like the windows will be bigger, plus they need to add the balconies (and entrances thereto) so I'm assuming the current brutalist facade, presumably non-load-bearing, will be completely removed.