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+--- Thread: Streetlight LED Conversion (/showthread.php?tid=614)
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - MidTowner - 09-20-2017
There's an interesting article in the Record today: 'They have stolen my night from me.'
Quote:Rob Stephens used to enjoy looking at the stars at night from his home of Louisa Street in Kitchener.There are a few other complaints along similar lines. Lots of interesting information about light pollution, cool versus warm light, and so on.
But he says that pleasure is gone, now that the city has replaced the street lights with more efficient LED lights.
"It lights up my whole front yard," he says. "It's ridiculously bright. It's like daylight out there."
It also noted that "Kitchener plans to address that by dimming all its street lights by 20 to 30 per cent once the system is fully in place" and that it "urges anyone who feels the lights are too bright to contact their city or the region, since it may be possible to install a shield or to tilt the lamp slightly to redirect light." And: "The city also is developing a plan to dim lights further on quieter streets between about 11 p.m. and 6 a.m. when traffic is lightest, Cronkite said."
All great stuff.
I can sympathize with these complaints. I hate lights at night, and have tried to plant strategically where I live to block it to the extent possible. Street lights aren't going away any time soon, though, so it's exciting the flexibility that the municipality will have with the new LEDs.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - jeffster - 09-20-2017
What I find a little odd is that on King St between Cedar and Ottawa, the lights along there are already pretty dim. (though go down to Charles and you'd think you're entering a stadium during a night game)
I like the idea of the money savings, but there should have been a way to have a better colour to the lights. LED's have come a long way, so having a warm yellow colour shouldn't be an issue anymore.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - tomh009 - 09-20-2017
Personally I like the cool white light.
Anyway, we do need street lights in the city, for both vehicles and pedestrians, and the new LED lights maximize the lighting of the streets themselves while minimizing stray light and light pollution. If someone wants to have a house without street lights, living in the townships is really the only option.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - danbrotherston - 09-20-2017
White provides better visibility.
I suspect much of this is "it's different" and not "it's worse". Light pollution especially. The cut off of these lights is amazing. They're barely lit from the side.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - MidTowner - 09-20-2017
"White provides better visibility." That's not true- the higher the kelvin, the more glare, and visibility is compromised. Lower (warmer) is better, for many reasons. According to the article, the ones being installed here are, while cooler than the sodium lamps, within new guidelines from the American Medical Association.
The cut-off on the new fixtures does seem very good.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - danbrotherston - 09-20-2017
(09-20-2017, 08:50 AM)MidTowner Wrote: "White provides better visibility." That's not true- the higher the kelvin, the more glare, and visibility is compromised. ...
While this sounds like a reasonable explanation, it is contradicted by (at least some of) the scholarly research on the subject which finds that detection distance is better (more distant ) of higher temp lights like metal halide and LED.
I would guess this is likely because our eyes are optimally adapted to see this colour light (it of course being closer to the colour of sunlight).
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1477153515619777
Of course as you say there are other advantages to warmer light, it is not as likely to trick our brains into believing it is daytime etc.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - MidTowner - 09-20-2017
It doesn't look like that paper is accessible... It also doesn't seem to discuss visibility in the presence of different coloured lights, though.
Yes, the disruption to our (and animals') circadian rhythm is a lot less with warmer lights.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - danbrotherston - 09-20-2017
No, sadly like most academic papers they are only accessible to those who pay, but the abstract is quite detailed.
It discusses LED vs HPS which is the exact transition we are making.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - GtwoK - 09-20-2017
Anecdotal, but I personally have found the new lights to have a higher visibility. My glasses magnified the glare from the old lights tenfold, and every streetlight looked like a starburst, made driving at night very difficult. With the more concentrated beam from the new lights, I don't get that starburst effect.
As well, for whatever reason, driving under that yellow glow always made me sleepy, but I've yet to experience that with the new lights
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - KevinL - 09-20-2017
(09-20-2017, 04:21 PM)GtwoK Wrote: As well, for whatever reason, driving under that yellow glow always made me sleepy, but I've yet to experience that with the new lights
That's precisely it - the yellow lights are like the setting sun and give you a late-day feeling; the whiter LEDs are more like the middle of the day.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - MidTowner - 09-21-2017
Although I'm willing to admit I might be wrong about the glare/visibility thing, and maybe cooler light really does make for better visibility, what you just said is a really bad aspect of cooler light: they're more like the middle of the day. That's bad for people's sleep (and StatsCan just this week released new data saying that- no real surprise- Canadians are not sleeping enough), which has big health impacts. It also has big impacts on other living things, who are not able to perceive night properly because of our lighting.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - tomh009 - 09-21-2017
However ... even assuming that the colour of the light has a big impact on people's (or animals') sleep (as compared to the old lights) that is mitigated by the tighter focus of the light on roadways and sidewalks, with less light spilling into house windows or into the greenery.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - MidTowner - 09-21-2017
Yes, it's true. As others have said, the new fixtures are much better generally at focusing light where it's needed, and reducing light pollution.
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - tomh009 - 09-21-2017
I should have added: the biggest difference is for people who like their sidewalks to be dim or unlit ("They took away my night"). But for most people, well-lit sidewalks are both more pleasant and more safe than dim or dark ones. (This does not just to reduce risk of aggressors; it also makes it easier to see hazards on the sidewalk that could cause tripping or falls.)
RE: Streetlight LED Conversion - JoeKW - 09-21-2017
The Kitchener lights will apparently be dimmed by 20% when the upgrades are complete, so hopefully that will satisfy most people.